Sunday, October 5, 2008

Why The Bailout Is 100% Doomed, In Under 1,000 Words.

The bailout legislation passed Friday is doomed to failure. It CANNOT succeed.

Why?

First, it is too little, too late. $700BB is only about 3.5% of the total housing stock of around $20TT.

Second, banks will have learned their lesson, and NOT lend to shaky credits. Or they will. And we will start this thing over, but there will be no accompanying price bubble. People will begin defaulting almost immediately because prices are falling.

What the bailout actually does is ensure The Worst Of All Economic Worlds: STAGFLATION.

The Cause Was A Price Bubble. The Cure Is Popping It. That's All.

This bailout is like "bailing out" the hamburger market that has recently gone to $30/lb. But now, it's FALLING, and it's at $20/lb! OH NO! Let's BAIL IT OUT! Let's get it back to $30/lb.!

Nonsense, of course. Goods that go to unsustainable prices must simply fall back to prices in line with incomes & substitutes. That means home must be in line with local incomes and must provide a comparable return as rentals. At the peak, Bend homes were priced at negative returns FOREVER. At the peak, 92% of all Bend homes were unaffordable to families making 120% of the median family income.

Prediction: Obama wins, and he will oversee The Worst economic malaise since the Great Depression. Question is, will he be a Carter or an FDR?

There is No Question, The Bailout Is Doomed. We will all begin to realize THAT in the coming weeks & months. There is ONLY ONE CURE: Home prices falling to parity with incomes. That's all. All else prolongs and intensifies the pain.

We are in a death spiral of bad loans, default, and foreclosure, a cycle that will repeat itself until we hit bottom. So, in addition to local incomes & rental return parity, people must Get Loans to buy houses, and that will NOT HAPPEN until it looks like housing has hit bottom AND is headed up. Believe me, Banks Will Not Loan Money At The Bottom. Only after a few years of stable to rising prices will they lend.

THAT Final Nail In The Housing Coffin is why home prices are headed LOWER than they were before this thing got started. That's why Bend could easily hit $120K medians AND STAY THERE FOR YEARS.

Prediction: Banks will HORDE this cash. The Gov't will ultimately have to INSURE HOME LOANS to get lending going again. But all this will be after a wave of foreclosures & continuing PLUMMETING of prices.

452 comments:

«Oldest   ‹Older   1 – 200 of 452   Newer›   Newest»
Marge said...

September sales local information for Bend Orygun follows:

Sold 119 at $277+k median (not dropping or going up).Highest volume of the year.
I suppose you need something to compare those #'s to.
August..Sold 97 @ $282k median.
YTD 2008 to date 9/30 Sold 862 @ 299k median.
2007 YTD 9/30 Sold 1238 @ $349k median.
2006 going back...Sold 1693 @ $351k median.

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

Nice marge! So total $ volume sold:

2008: $257.7MM
2007: $432.1MM
2006: $594.2MM

I bet that drops into the $100's next year for Q1 + Q2 + Q3.

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

We're looking at a cold, glum Winter. The next 6 months folks... Oct - Mar, that's when we're going to find people frozen to death in their cars, people getting shot for pocket change, Mether Gangs... it's going to get bad.

And it's going to spread to The West Side. THAT is when you are going to see a mass exodus. THAT is when those ridiculously overpriced $500-800K crap shacks will go into the $300's.

Don't matter the losses... when your friends and neighbors are getting shot.

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

One Kernel Of Wisdom I just remembered:

Remember when EVERYONE was saying HOME PRICES WILL NEVER FALL! They've NEVER FALLEN IN MODERN HISTORY!

This thing was supposed to be a tiny blip on an otherwise ever-expanding Goldilocks economy? Remember that?

Yeah... this thing will have all sorts of UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES as it unwinds. All sorts of UNPRECEDENTED EVENTS will occur. All sorts of stuff you never, EVER thought would happen, WILL.

Anonymous said...

First, it is too little, too late. $700BB is only about 3.5% of the total housing stock of around $20TT.

*

It's NOT housing HOMER. It's the WHOLE shah-bang going down.

Housing $20T of which 25-50% will be non-conforming.


Derivatives: $160T, most of which have no buyers.

Credit Swap Defaults: $80T, of which there are no buyers, this is why AIG went down, and Lehman.

Money Market: Sitting on SIV's, another $10T+ figure 30 cents on the dollar maybe.

FDIC: Is now below $40B, and will be gone in six months so who cares if insurance is $100k or $250k?? Let's make it $1M.

The problem is confidence. The $700T is like 0.02% of the problem. Sure it will help with confidence.

Bend-RE is/was the worst. There never were any jobs in Bend, just fake money. Bend will clear as folks drift to places where they can work.

OR-BOMB-EO can still lose. Palin will hammer the 'terrorist connection' and Rev-Wright continually in the coming month.

Anonymous said...

See homer you can do it, a short sweet 10 min post on sunday.

It doen't have to have pic's of DOWN's baby's and stream video.

Anonymous said...

Here's a breakdown of some of the economic rescue plan's main provisions:

Attacking credit crisis: The core of the plan the House voted on is the same as what it rejected on Monday: the Treasury's proposal to let financial institutions sell to the government their troubled assets, mostly mortgage-related. It will allow the Treasury access to the $700 billion in stages, with $250 billion being made available immediately.

Protecting taxpayers: The final law is also similar to the original House bill in that it includes a number of provisions that supporters say will protect taxpayers. One will direct the president to propose a bill requiring the financial industry to reimburse taxpayers for any net losses from the program after five years. And the Treasury will be allowed to take ownership stakes in participating companies.

In addition, over time, supporters say, taxpayers are likely to make back much if not all of the money the Treasury uses because it will be investing in assets with underlying value.

The law includes a stipulation that the Treasury set up an insurance program - to be funded with risk-based premiums paid by the industry - to guarantee companies' troubled assets, including mortgage-backed securities, purchased before March 14, 2008.

Curbing executive pay: The law will place curbs on executive pay for companies selling assets or buying insurance from Uncle Sam. For example, any bonus or incentive paid to a senior executive officer for targets met will have to be repaid if it's later proven that earnings or profit statements were inaccurate.

Oversight: The rescue plan will set up two oversight committees.

A Financial Stability Board will include the Federal Reserve chairman, the Securities and Exchange Commission chairman, the Federal Home Finance Agency director, the Housing and Urban Development secretary and the Treasury secretary.

A congressional oversight panel, to which the Financial Stability Board will report, will have five members appointed by House and Senate leadership from both parties.

Tax breaks: The Senate-version of the bill that the House passed on Friday included three key tax elements designed to attract House Republican votes.

It extends a number of renewable energy tax breaks for individuals and businesses, including a deduction for the purchase of solar panels.

The law also continues a host of other expiring tax breaks. Among them: the research and development credit for businesses and the credit that allows individuals to deduct state and local sales taxes on their federal returns.

In addition, the law includes relief for another year from the Alternative Minimum Tax, without which millions of Americans would have to pay the so-called "income tax for the wealthy."

New accounting rules: The bailout plan underlines the Securities and Exchange Commission's power to change accounting rules on how banks and Wall Street firms value securities, and directs the agency to study the issue.

Some observers argue that tight accounting rules are a major reason for the credit crisis in the first place. Others contend that changing the so-called mark-to-market rules will just bury problems lurking beneath the surface and could further shake investor confidence in the already battered financial sector. (More about the rules.)

Shielding bank deposits: The law temporarily raises the FDIC insurance cap to $250,000 from $100,000. It allows the FDIC to borrow from the Treasury to cover any losses that might occur as a result of the higher insurance limit.

Federal bank regulators, who first floated the idea to Congress late Tuesday, said that bumping up the insurance limits will help improve liquidity at banks across the country. It may also provide a much-needed dose of confidence for consumers who may be worried about the health of their bank. (More about FDIC rules.)

The plan will also temporarily increase the level of federal insurance for credit union savings to $250,000.

Mitigating foreclosures: The new law calls on federal agencies to encourage loan servicers to modify mortgages by a number of means - including reducing the principal or interest rate. It also extends a temporary provision that exempts from federal income tax any debt forgiven by a bank to a borrower in a foreclosure.

Cost: The law's tax provisions - the bulk of which come from the addition of tax breaks from other legislation - may reduce federal tax revenue by $110 billion over 10 years, according to estimates from the Joint Committee on Taxation. More than half of that is due to the one-year extension of AMT relief.

Anonymous said...

What is fair value?

Still, others contend that it was not real financial losses from these securities that led to the credit crunch as much as it was an arcane accounting rule known as "mark-to-market."

Mark-to-market means that companies have to report what the fair value of their investments were if they sold them at the current time.

In recent years, firms were required by the Securities and Exchange Commission and the Federal Accounting Standards Board to use mark-to-market valuations for all the MBS on their books.

As more subprime borrowers started to default on their loans, that quickly eroded the value of many MBS pools. Major banks and financial firms around the globe have taken writedowns topping $500 billion in the last year, as a result.

For this reason, some have argued that fixing the rule would solve the credit crisis.

"The SEC has destroyed about $500 billion of capital by their continued insistence that mortgage-backed securities be valued at market value when there is no market," said William Isaac, a former chairman of the FDIC.

"And because banks essentially lend $10 for every dollar of capital they have, they've essentially destroyed $5 trillion in lending capacity," he added.

Isaac believes that since the overwhelming majority of loans packaged together in even the weakest MBS pools are not in foreclosure, it is proper to value these securities based on the flow

Anonymous said...

Too little, too late

Accounting experts also think that determining the value of pools of loans based on expected payments isn't any easier than figuring out their market value after demand has dried up. Rising default and foreclosure rates makes estimates about future value very suspect.

"People talk about 'hold to maturity', 'economic value.' I'm in the business and I don't know what that means," said David Larsen, managing director at financial advisory firm Duff & Phelps.

Larsen said that even with the new guidance from the SEC and FASB, it's not clear if accountants and chief financial officers are going to be able to ignore the sharp drop in market value for MBS pools in the current environment.

"To try to put a genie back in the bottle and go backwards from a transparency point of view makes little sense," said Larsen.

Others argue that the potential benefit to banks and Wall Street firms from a rule change is much less than is widely assumed since much of the writedowns have already occurred.

And it's too late to save the large financial institutions that have collapsed because of exposure to soured mortgages.

"I think mark to market is seen as a panacea, but I don't think it's that simple," said Brian Gardner, the Washington analyst for KBW, an investment firm that focuses on the financial services industry. "I don't think it's as big a deal for a lot of the banks."

Anonymous said...

the Treasury's proposal to let financial institutions sell to the government their troubled assets, mostly mortgage-related.

*

'mostly', this is like OR-BOMB-EO's 'hope', or Palin's 'terrorist'.

Can you imagine the racket? I buy from you worthless asset's, then I sell them to the guvvy for top dollar, then I go back and buy more worthless assets. This is going to cause a worthless asset bubble.

They're worthless, because they have no buyers, now you have ONE BUYER. Trouble is like FDIC we'll have to wait and watch how quick this money BURN's.

With 100's of TRILLIONS of assets having evaporated, the $250B initial should burn very quickly.

The WAR, can you imagine how the lobbyists will be sucking PAULSON cock? Will OR-BOMB-EO have the NUT's to dump PAULSON? Or will PAULSON die in office like Gay-Edgar-Hoover? Will treasury now be like FED-RES chairman, an office held for life?

The good news is that there is a limited amount of money. That capital has largely dried up, that NO amount of confidence can be brought to the USA, that OR-BOMB-EO, and Mc$ain are the McSame. That BUSH crony's will stay around and run the GUVVY for years to come.

Anonymous said...

"The SEC has destroyed about $500 billion of capital by their continued insistence that mortgage-backed securities be valued at market value when there is no market," said William Isaac, a former chairman of the FDIC.

"And because banks essentially lend $10 for every dollar of capital they have, they've essentially destroyed $5 trillion in lending capacity," he added.


*

NOT TRUE, in the 1930's true, but today banks loan $100 for every dollar of 'capital', thus using this reasoning $50Trillion is off the table.

We wish they could only borrow ten to one, some estimates is that the leveraging today is between 100X->1000X, yes pre-depression it was 10X, and economy collapse 1/10X, but today it's more like 1/1000X de-leveraging contraction.

It's going to take YEAR's, and who are we going to borrow from for the next war in ten years? Will USA public finance the next war with saving's bond's? A USA public that no longer save's?? and has NOTHING to save?

Anonymous said...

It also extends a temporary provision that exempts from federal income tax any debt forgiven by a bank to a borrower in a foreclosure.

*

There's NEVER been a better time to walk away.

This 'bailout' really is/was for everybody.

The lawyer's & cpa's GOLDRUSH, PAULSON is creating ten new companys today, and is hiring 1,000's of CPA's & Lawyers to administer this 'bailout'.

mike said...

I am from Bend and now reside in Arizona. My father owned, and made real good $$$ from some of the earliest land purchases at DRW in the 60's. I sold my last acre there in 1976 for 2K ! I need to be on alert for the awesome deals at all of the yard (estate) sales at the far west side of town. I am soooo excited that most of the Cali-bangers will be gone. I can remember when if you said that you were from Cali, you would get punched hard in the nose as an Oregon welcome. It looks like I will be able to move back to my hometown in the next year as the prices come back to reality. Thanks to whoever created this blog.

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

I can remember when if you said that you were from Cali, you would get punched hard in the nose as an Oregon welcome.

We call those The Good 'Ol Days.

Let's hope for their quick return.

A dude named BEM instituted this Bend Housing Blogging stuff.

Marge said...

Football must be good tonight.Brucey, how's that fantasy?

I finally heard a great explanation on OPB today of CDS's. People that don't know what they are can't even begin to fear what they will do to our economy. Now there is even more fear in me after getting it. 60 Trillion+- in CDS', unbelieve shell game. Bend will be a ghost town when that shit really hits the fan. Glad I bought another pocket pistol and more ammo.
Leavin town for awhile and hope I can catch WiFi once in a few.

Anonymous said...

from the WSJ:

* OCTOBER 6, 2008

A Street Longtimer Speaks

Mr. Glickenhaus Sees Bounce, But Worries Gains May Not Last; 9500 on the Dow?

Seth Glickenhaus, one of the few still on Wall Street who worked there during the Depression, thinks the stock market may be bottoming -- temporarily.

Mr. Glickenhaus first worked for a Wall Street firm in the summer of 1929, and founded his own money-management firm in 1938. He thinks battered stocks are due to rebound, but he worries they could fall again later.

He is keeping 20% of his clients' money in cash, the highest level he remembers having.

Now 94 years old, Mr. Glickenhaus still serves as chief investment officer of Glickenhaus & Co., which manages $1.8 billion for wealthy individuals and a few pension funds.

"You have one conspicuous difference between this and the 1929 break," he said, using a common Wall Street euphemism to avoid saying "crash."

"In the '29 break you had [President] Hoover and [Treasury Secretary] Andrew Mellon contracting all the way. They believed that it wasn't the role of the government to get involved. This time, the government is moving heaven and earth to reverse the cycle," he said.

Earlier this year, nervous investors were phoning advisers with 30 or 40 years' experience, looking for their perspectives on the financial crisis. Now, investors are looking for people with longer experience. Mr. Glickenhaus got his training as a municipal bond trader at Salomon Brothers & Hutzler (now part of Citigroup) after studying economics and graduating from Harvard in 1934.

Calls from people seeking his guidance started coming in "a few months ago, when it first became apparent that the country was in trouble," said Mr. Glickenhaus, who commutes to his Manhattan office from his home in suburban New Rochelle. A few clients have pulled their money out of the stock market entirely, while a few others have given him more money, banking on his experience.

Glickenhaus & Co.'s accounts are down this year through July, but less than the broad market. Over the past five years, its accounts have had an average annual gain of 17%, compared with 7% for the Standard & Poor's 500, according to Morningstar Inc.

Although Mr. Glickenhaus thinks stocks have fallen so far that a short-term rebound is likely, the economy is so weak and the financial system so damaged that a "recession or even possible depression will last for at least five years," he warned. "Eventually, we could get to 9500 easily on the Dow" Jones Industrial Average, a decline of about 8% from Friday's finish of 10325.38.

"We've gotten soft in the United States, politically, economically and in every way. We've had so much prosperity that we can't compete any more. Those days are gone, except in small companies. In things like autos -- those days are gone," said Mr. Glickenhaus, once a big Chrysler investor.

He is optimistic for the developing world, and he likes stocks linked to energy demand and to developing countries' need for raw materials.

"We like pipeline stocks with good yields and stable businesses," said Mr. Glickenhaus, who prefers to buy stocks when they look inexpensive and have good prospects. These companies transport and store oil, gas and other natural liquids. "And we like dry bulk carriers -- which run ships that transport iron ore, coal, wheat, cement, fertilizer, things of that sort to China."

Among his favorites: pipeline stocks Enterprise Products Partners, Energy Transfer Partners and Boardwalk Pipeline Partners, and shipping companies Navios Maritime Holdings, Eagle Bulk Shipping and Excel Maritime Carriers.

Mr. Glickenhaus isn't putting clients into government bonds or corporate bonds. He doesn't think government bonds yield enough and doesn't trust ratings agencies to evaluate corporate bonds effectively.

For all his years on Wall Street, he has no sympathy for those who led us into the crisis.

"People are frightened and very angry," Mr. Glickenhaus said. "They feel that everything that has been done is to benefit Wall Street and these preposterous salaries and termination pay packages that leaders of these companies get, irrespective of how good or bad a job they have done. In some cases, they did a more miserable job than you believe. I am not so pessimistic about the future of the stock market. I am more pessimistic about the future of business."

Write to E.S. Browning at jim.browning@wsj.com

bruce said...

Football is all good.

Marge, now you know what I've been harping on. Paper backing paper with a promise to pay on default, but it's gotten so big nobody can pay and nobody trusts each other because nobody know what the others are holding. All these derivatives need to be transparent, and on their balance sheets.

bruce said...

Oct 5, 11:31 AM EDT

Mortgage forgiven for woman, 90, who shot herself

AKRON, Ohio (AP) -- Mortgage finance company Fannie Mae said it is forgiving the mortgage debt of a 90-year-old woman who shot herself in the chest as sheriff's deputies attempted to evict her.

Addie Polk's plight was cited by Rep. Dennis Kucinich, D-Ohio, on Friday before the House voted to approve the $700 billion financial rescue package. Kucinich voted against the plan.

Fannie Mae announced later Friday that it would dismiss its foreclosure action, forgive Polk's mortgage and allow her to return to the Akron home where she's lived since 1970.

"Just given the circumstances, we think it's appropriate," Fannie Mae spokesman Brian Faith said, citing Kucinich's statement and news reports. "It certainly made our radar screen."

Polk remained in Akron General Medical Center and was expected to recover from chest wounds suffered last week.

She became the home's sole owner in 1995 when her husband died, then took out a mortgage loan in 1997 and refinanced several times, court and property records show.

Countrywide Home Loans filed for foreclosure last year, and Polk's home was sold to Fannie Mae at a sheriff's auction in June. Deputies were to escort Polk from her home Wednesday when gunshots were heard inside.

Polk's longtime neighbor, Robert Dillon, climbed through her window and found her lying in bed bleeding with a gun next to her. He visited Polk in the hospital on Friday.

"She said it was a crazy thing to do, now that she's had time to think about it," Dillon said.

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

Oregon’s 83 credit unions safe, officials say

Read this piece. There's NOTHING to support this headline.

ALL of Oregon's CU's are "SAFE"?

Yet Another Please don't start a run on a bank... or credit union piece.

Anonymous said...

Yep, the stock market at 9500 today, and we'll see the 911 7500 soon, and much lower.

We're simply going to see actual historical 12/1 price/earn ratio set, and these days with neg-earning's, its going to be very low.

Also MOST company's are in debt to the hilt, 100X or higher to assets. Thus with a total drop in sales, they can't pay the debt, vicious cycle, ... bankruptcy.

Expect major call for blanket 'bail-out bill' for all over leveraged company's.

Anonymous said...

Most credit unions didn't do 'stupid shit'.

WAMU did stupid shit, and was putting un-employed renters into homes of their own.

The credit-union I use will not even 'loan' to self-employed people, you must have a job, and you can only borrow on 25% of verified income.

There maybe some Oregon Credit Unions that played lose, I know there is one up in Vancouver(WA) that 'invested' in a mall and/or STD, and they went down, but most Oregon Credit Unions ran their bank the old fashion way.

If your worried shop around for credit, and find a credit-union that will not loan you money, and then get a CD in that credit union. If they fall over themselves to loan you money, you know they're idiots, and idiots are going down in this cycle.

Yes, I would say 'most' credit unions in Oregon, are fairly safe, and that the 'others' regional/national are un-safe.

I like BofA, and more so USBANK, I'm leary of WellsFargo which was too easy with loans. I think for national BofA & USBANK will be last man standing, and most regionals will go down. The credit unions that didn't over expand and let non-bankers run them will survive.

I have seen many credit unions get taken over by non-bankers, and run the credit union like a candy store. New building's ostentatious office space, its easy to spot these 'excessive' credit unions.

I advise a mix use USBANK and/or BofA mix stuff around, and use a few credit union's for CD's, as they're local and USBANK is national.

Still BEST to keep REAL-MONEY in EURO or some other non-usa form not in this country, and NOT recorded in this country. You have to travel to foreign shores in order to properly open foreign accounts, once they're setup you can wire money to your national either direction. These days you can even go to Canada and open an account and get a 'bank-card', historically canada isn't as stupid and greedy as the US, and besides when the SHIT hits the fan, they'll let you in Canada if you have money in the Bank, and the same for Australia & New Zealand, no money, no entry.

Anonymous said...

At Mid Oregon — which has branches in Bend, Redmond and Prineville, and is building a new branch in Madras — the credit union makes most of its loans for autos and RVs, Anderson said. Mid Oregon also originates residential mortgage loans for its members, but it sells most of them on the secondary mortgage market, he said.

*

There's a red-herring homer, boats&rv's, central-oregon, ... no job, contractor, what's the first to go? Who has the most non-performaning loans?

This is typical they don't do MTG, unless your gold.

Credit Unions are good for 'floating' a credit-card, checking account at nice 9% rate, with no funny charges and rackets, which ALL the majors do.

Yep, if 'MY' credit union did Boats RV's, ... I would RUN and quick.

Anonymous said...

I think the story about credit unions in the BULL, is that you can put any BIZ near Bend, and FUCK IT UP.

In the valley most credit unions are sweet and don't do stupid shit.

Put anything including a credit union in central oregon, and then start making loans for hummers, boats, RV's, and wave-runners, ... TOYS, and NOTE most contractors we're dumping their TOYS as early as 2005.

Typically BULL in a total meltdown, they try to find something good to say.


The only good storys about central-oregon, will be the storys of those who moved, and started anew, and found a job.

Anonymous said...

Football is all good.

*

Football is NOT good, just another TV racket.

Just look at the fucking commercials on these games.

Go to Deschutes Brew Pub on Monday night, it used to be a cheap-beer night, now its 'monday night football', just a bunch of has BEND high-school players and coaches sitting on their enormous fat asses.

I'll say one thing FOOTBALL is USA, obese people watching insipid TV, beautiful young girls in hardly any clothes shaking their ass & pom-pom's, and young black stud's injuring themselves; ONLY in AmeriKKKa.

Anonymous said...

Now the following is BIG news, now that the USA is down & out!!! The Nazi's can once again step to the plate.


Germany to allow domestic military deployment

By DAVID RISING – 1 hour ago

BERLIN (AP) — Germany's governing coalition partners want to change the constitution to allow for military deployment within the country if needed to combat terrorism, officials said Monday.

The proposal would allow use of the military only if police are overwhelmed and cannot properly respond to a situation themselves.

"It is not to be used generally, but only in very specific cases," Interior Ministry spokeswoman Daniela-Alexandra Pietsch said.

The center-left Social Democratic Party — which makes up half of Chancellor Angela Merkel's coalition — had been opposed to the proposal but agreed late Sunday after working out an agreement that includes strict guidelines for domestic deployment.

"We're talking only about emergency help," Social Democrat parliamentary leader Peter Struck said. For example, the navy could be called to help in a situation where police maritime patrols were not sufficient, he said.

The proposal will now go to Merkel's Cabinet and then to parliament for approval.

Given Germany's militaristic past, many are hesitant to expand the role of soldiers domestically. Currently, the German military can be deployed within the country only in times of war, or to help with emergencies or natural disasters.

Following the announcement of the new proposal, opposition Left Party lawmaker Petra Pau accused the government of seeking to violate a constitutionally dictated division "between army, police and secret services."

"The military has no role domestically for historic, political, legal and professional reasons," Pau said.

Germany used Tornado fighter jets to secure airspace during last year's Group of Eight summit, while troops helped provide support to police controlling demonstrations.

Merkel's government at the time defended the deployment as necessary to secure the area and provide technical and logistical support for police. But the opposition Greens party criticized it as "a creeping breach of the constitution."

Anonymous said...

BP & the NAZI shit HERE is getting VERY interesting, and your OR-BOMB-EO will embrace this shit.

***

Homeland Security’s Space-Based Spying Goes Live

by Tom Burghardt / October 6th, 2008

While America’s attention has shifted to the economic meltdown and the presidential race between corporate favorites John McCain and Barack Obama, The Wall Street Journal reported Wednesday that the Department of Homeland Security’s (DHS) National Applications Office (NAO) “will proceed with the first phase of a controversial satellite-surveillance program, even though an independent review found the department hasn’t yet ensured the program will comply with privacy laws.”

As I wrote in June, NAO will coordinate how domestic law enforcement and “disaster relief” agencies such as FEMA use satellite imagery intelligence (IMINT) generated by U.S. spy satellites. Based on available evidence, hard to come by since these programs are classified “above top secret,” the technological power of these military assets are truly terrifying.

Unlike commercial satellites that beam TV programs, forecast the weather or provide global positioning services, their military cousins are far more flexible, have greater resolution and therefore, more power to monitor human activity. By utilizing different parts of the light- and infrared spectrum, spy satellites, in addition to taking ultra high-resolution photographs to within a meter of their “target,” can also track the heat signatures generated by people inside a building. (”Homeland Security’s Space-Based Spies,” Antifascist Calling, June 4, 2008)

In other words, when combined with illegal NSA and FBI domestic surveillance programs–from data-mining to the massive interception of telephone and internet communications–NAO will furnish DHS and outsourced corporate grifters who actually run the program, with the blanket coverage of American citizens long sought by securocrats. Aside from The Wall Street Journal and The Raw Story, not a single media outlet has disclosed this vital information to the public.

Despite the absence of rigorous oversight that would determine whether or not NAO complies with what’s left of privacy laws, DHS is proceeding full speed ahead. The Journal reports,

A new 60-page Government Accountability Office report said the department “lacks assurance that NAO operations will comply with applicable laws and privacy and civil liberties standards,” according to a person familiar with the document. The report, which is unclassified but considered sensitive, hasn’t been publicly released, but was described and quoted by several people who have read it.

The report cites gaps in privacy safeguards. The department, it found, lacks controls to prevent improper use of domestic-intelligence data by other agencies and provided insufficient assurance that requests for classified information will be fully reviewed to ensure it can be legally provided. ( Siobhan Gorman, “Satellite-Surveillance Program to Begin Despite Privacy Concerns,” The Wall Street Journal, October 1, 2008) [emphasis added]

Reporting on the shocking absence of oversight features built into the program, Nick Juliano writes,

Essentially, the bill only requires the Homeland Security Secretary to assure lawmakers that NAO programs comply with exisiting laws. Congress also has required the DHS Inspector General to provide quarterly classified reports on how much information has been collected by the domestic satellite surveillance, although the bill required those reports be made to the House and Senate Appropriations Committees, not the Homeland Security Committees that are traditionally in charge of DHS oversight. (”DHS satellite spy program going forward despite objections,” The Raw Story, October 2, 2008)

The GAO’s suppressed report is not the first to criticize the breathtaking scope of this repressive program. The Congressional Research Service (CRS) issued a study in June raising critical questions about NAO’s legality.

Members of Congress and outside groups have raised concerns that using satellites for law enforcement purposes may infringe on the privacy and Fourth Amendment rights of U.S. persons. Other commentators have questioned whether the proposed surveillance will violate the Posse Comitatus Act or other restrictions on military involvement in civilian law enforcement, or would otherwise exceed the statutory mandates of the agencies involved. Such concerns led Congress to preclude any funds in the Consolidated Appropriations Act, 2008 (H.R. 2764, P.L. 110-161), from being used to “commence operations of the National Applications Office … until the Secretary [of the Department of Homeland Security] certifies that these programs comply with all existing laws, including all applicable privacy and civil liberties standards, and that certification is reviewed by the Government Accountability Office.” (Section 525.) Similar language has been included in FY2009 homeland security appropriations bills. (Richard A. Best Jr. and Jennifer K. Elsea, “Satellite Surveillance: Domestic Issues,” Congressional Research Service, June 27, 2008)

But as the Journal reported, Congress’ “partial funding” for the program in “a little-debated $634 billion spending measure,” means that an operational NAO will now provide federal, state and local officials “with extensive access to spy-satellite imagery–but no eavesdropping–to assist with emergency response and other domestic-security needs, such as identifying where ports or border areas are vulnerable to terrorism.”

Such hollow “no eavesdropping” assurances to Congress from quarterly classified reports from the DHS Inspector General fly in the face of the steady erosion of constitutional protections by the Bush administration.

What “other agencies” might the GAO have in mind when citing concerns over potential abuse of intelligence data supplied by the National Applications Office? Well, take your pick since the U.S. “intelligence community” is comprised of 16 different agencies under the operational control of the Office of National Intelligence (ODI) and the powerful Office of the Director of National Intelligence (ODNI).

Led by Michael McConnell, a ten-year veteran of the spooky Booz Allen Hamilton corporation, purchased this year by the sinister Carlyle Group, ODNI can truly be described as a “public-private partnership” in political repression. As CorpWatch reported in March,

McConnell … spent more than 10 years as a Booz Allen senior vice president in charge of the company’s extensive contracts in military intelligence and information operations for the Pentagon. In that job, his official biography states, McConnell provided intelligence support to “the U.S. Unified Combatant Commanders, the Director of National Intelligence Agencies, and the Military Service Intelligence Directors.” That made him a close colleague of not only Donald Rumsfeld, who ran the Pentagon from 2001 to 2007, but of Vice President Cheney, who has served President Bush as a kind of intelligence godfather since the earliest days of the administration. (Tim Shorrock, “Carlyle Group May Buy Major CIA Contractor: Booz Allen Hamilton,” CorpWatch, March 8, 2008)

Investigative journalist Tim Shorrock revealed last year, that the intelligence-sharing system to be managed by NAO,

…will rely heavily on private contractors including Boeing, BAE Systems, L-3 Communications and Science Applications International Corporation (SAIC). These companies already provide technology and personnel to U.S. agencies involved in foreign intelligence, and the NAO greatly expands their markets. Indeed, at an intelligence conference in San Antonio, Texas, last month, the titans of the industry were actively lobbying intelligence officials to buy products specifically designed for domestic surveillance. (”Domestic Spying, Inc.” CorpWatch, November 27, 2007)

NAO will utilize the military imagery and mapping tools of the National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency (NGA). NGA maintains a symbiotic relationship with both the NSA and the ultra-secret National Reconnaissance Office (NRO), that builds and maintains America’s fleet of spy satellites. Additionally, NRO operates the planetary wide network of ground stations where NSA’s signals intelligence (SIGINT) and NGA’s imagery intelligence (IMINT) are processed and analyzed.

Shorrock revealed that the program was kick-started in 2005 and the impetus came from veteran spooks with extensive ties to the military-industrial-security apparatus and corporate outfits such as Booz Allen Hamilton. The company was “tasked” with studying how “intelligence from spy satellites and photoreconnaissance planes could be better used domestically to track potential threats to security within the U.S.” Completed in 2005, the Booz Allen plan became the basis for NAO.

Veteran spook Charles Allen told The Wall Street Journal in August 2007 that NAO is “an idea whose time has arrived.” As DHS chief intelligence officer, Allen will head the new program.

Additionally, an “independent study group” appointed in 2005 by the Director of National Intelligence, tasked with reviewing the deployment of military reconnaissance assets in the “homeland” reached the desired conclusions. According to a press release by the Department of Homeland Security,

The study group unanimously recommended in its September 2005 report that the scope of the Civil Applications Committee be expanded beyond civil applications to include homeland security and law enforcement applications, and concluded that there is an urgent need for action. The study group concluded a new approach is needed to effectively employ Intelligence Community capabilities for civil applications, homeland security and law enforcement uses. (”Fact Sheet: National Applications Office,” Department of Homeland Security, August 15, 2007)

How “independent”? You make the call! Shorrock reported that the group,

… was chaired by Keith Hall, a Booz Allen vice president who manages his firm’s extensive contracts with the NGA and previously served as the director of the NRO.

Other members of the group included seven other former intelligence officers working for Booz Allen, as well as retired Army Lieutenant General Patrick M. Hughes, the former director of the DIA and vice president of homeland security for L-3 Communications, a key NSA contractor; and Thomas W. Conroy, the vice president of national security programs for Northrop Grumman, which has extensive contracts with the NSA and the NGA and throughout the intelligence community. (Shorrock, 2008, op. cit.)

From the start, the group’s findings were “heavily weighted” toward corporations “with a stake” in both foreign and domestic intelligence. No surprise then, when the group’s “contractor-advisers” called for “a major expansion in the domestic use of the spy satellites that they sell to the government.”

A power-grab by the ODNI and DHS should raise serious alarms of further encroachments by a lawless “unitary executive” and serve as a warning that domestic law enforcement is rapidly coming under the purview of opaque Pentagon spy agencies.

While the creeping militarization of civilian policing is not a new phenomenon, the NAO launch represents a qualitative leap towards the surveillance society dreamed up by Iran-Contra felon and former DARPA administrator John Poindexter, before he was kicked to the curb when plans for the Total Information Awareness (TIA) program first gained notoriety in 2003.

And like the newly-launched NAO, TIA was managed by none other than Booz Allen Hamilton and their sidekicks at the San Diego-based Science Applications International Corporation! Small world (of open-ended contracts for giant Bush regime-connected multinationals).

The NAO will be overseen by the National Applications Executive Council (NAEC). In turn, NAEC will be “tri-chaired” by the Deputy Secretary of Homeland Security, the Deputy Secretary of the Department of the Interior (DOI), and the Principal Deputy of the Director of National Intelligence, a position held by Donald M. Kerr.

As with the vast majority of top securocrats, Kerr has served in a multitude of capacities inside and outside government. When he ended his tenure as Director of the National Reconnaissance Office in 2007, Kerr joined ONI. The one-time CIA and FBI employee was also a SAIC executive vice president during the 1990s.

Tim Shorrock reported in his essential book, Spies for Hire, that Kerr described how “ninety-five percent of the resources over which we have stewardship in fact go out on a contract to our industrial base. It’s an important thing to recognize that we cannot function without this highly integrated industrial government team.” Brutal honesty for brutal times.

Despite rigorous objections by members of Congress and civil liberties’ groups to a program with the breathtaking potential to invade our privacy in newer and more lethal ways, NAO is now reality. America’s headlong flight towards constructing a post-Constitutional “new order” just added another brick in the wall.

Anonymous said...

Satellite-Surveillance Program to Begin Despite Privacy Concerns

6 oct 2008, WSJ

By SIOBHAN GORMAN


WASHINGTON -- The Department of Homeland Security will proceed with the first phase of a controversial satellite-surveillance program, even though an independent review found the department hasn't yet ensured the program will comply with privacy laws.

Congress provided partial funding for the program in a little-debated $634 billion spending measure that will fund the government until early March. For the past year, the Bush administration had been fighting Democratic lawmakers over the spy program, known as the National Applications Office.

The program is designed to provide federal, state and local officials with extensive access to spy-satellite imagery -- but no eavesdropping -- to assist with emergency response and other domestic-security needs, such as identifying where ports or border areas are vulnerable to terrorism.

Since the department proposed the program a year ago, several Democratic lawmakers have said that turning the spy lens on America could violate Americans' privacy and civil liberties unless adequate safeguards were required.

A new 60-page Government Accountability Office report said the department "lacks assurance that NAO operations will comply with applicable laws and privacy and civil liberties standards," according to a person familiar with the document. The report, which is unclassified but considered sensitive, hasn't been publicly released, but was described and quoted by several people who have read it.

The report cites gaps in privacy safeguards. The department, it found, lacks controls to prevent improper use of domestic-intelligence data by other agencies and provided insufficient assurance that requests for classified information will be fully reviewed to ensure it can be legally provided.

A senior homeland-security official took issue with the GAO's broad conclusion, saying the department has worked hard to include many layers of privacy protection. Program activities have "an unprecedented amount of legal review," he said, adding that the GAO is seeking a level of proof that can't be demonstrated until the program is launched.

Homeland Security spokeswoman Laura Keehner said department officials concluded that the program "complies with all existing laws" because the GAO report didn't say the program doesn't.

Addressing the gaps the agency cited, Ms. Keehner said current laws already govern the use of intelligence data and the department has an additional procedure to monitor its use. The department will also work with other intelligence agencies to "ensure that legal reviews and protection of classified information will be effective," she said.

In response to the GAO report, House Homeland Security Committee Chairman Bennie G. Thompson of Mississippi and other Democrats asked Congress to freeze the money for the program until after the November election so the next administration could examine it.

But the bill Congress approved, which President George W. Bush signed into law Tuesday, allows the department to launch a limited version, focused only on emergency response and scientific needs. The department must meet additional requirements before it can expand operations to include homeland-security and law-enforcement surveillance.

The restrictions were "the most we could have required without a complete prohibition," said Darek Newby, an aide to Democratic Rep. David Price of North Carolina, who heads the House homeland-security spending panel.

But California Rep. Jane Harman, who heads a homeland-security subcommittee on intelligence, said that even limited funding allows the department to launch the program, providing a platform to expand its surveillance whether or not privacy requirements are met.

"Having learned my lesson" with the National Security Agency's warrantless-surveillance program, she said, "I don't want to go there again unless and until the legal framework for the entire program is entirely spelled out."

Rep. Thompson vowed to fight expansion of the program until privacy issues are further addressed.

Anonymous said...

Expect a BIGGER bailout plan, very-very soon.

****

Can Bailout Spur Lending?
By DAVID REILLY - WSJ
6 oct 2008

Strong balance sheets breed confidence. It doesn't work the other way around.

That is why the House's second-try approval of the bailout legislation isn't likely to get banks, and debt investors, lending freely again Monday morning.

The bailout bill doesn't directly inject capital into banks and, through its indiscriminate backing of institutions, fails to cull the diseased herd. As the weak linger, questions will continue hanging over all banks, harming even those that would otherwise struggle through.

These shortcomings are potentially fatal flaws given the lack of faith in bank balance sheets. That is reflected in interbank lending rates, which have spiked to levels unseen since the early 1980s.

Given that banks don't trust one another, it shouldn't be surprising that investors are acting as if the entire banking system could be insolvent. They fear bank capital is actually a mirage because firms haven't adequately reflected losses.

Recent deals, like the sale of Washington Mutual's assets, have hammered that point home. In buying WaMu assets, J.P. Morgan Chase had to mark some loans down by about 20%. A similar scene played out when Bank of America bought Countrywide.

Yet the bailout bill doesn't force banks to more realistically mark their books, or raise capital. Nor is it clear how the Treasury will price purchases of bad assets from banks, muddying any potential impact on capital from these actions.

The bill also is unlikely to reverse the pullback in lending to nonfinancial companies. That means companies could face more trouble in coming months rolling their debt.

The result could be rising defaults that lead to a deeper and longer recession than investors expect. If that is the case, Congress may soon find itself haggling over another, bigger bailout plan.

Anonymous said...

Medians are still higher than when I bought in Dec. 2004. That just seems weird. I'm in for the long haul, and I expect to see houses like mine selling for less than I paid. This is just fine with me. I never wanted to pay high property taxes or see other working people kept out of home ownership.

bruce said...

Re: The study group concluded a new approach is needed to effectively employ Intelligence Community capabilities for civil applications, homeland security and law enforcement uses. NAO, etc.

This shit sucks. Obama may or may not embrace it, but he will be more wary of it than the Bush/Cheney neocons leading the charge. It's no coincidence they got the ball rolling before the next administration took charge. Steamrolled it in the last available funding bill, when everyone's eye was on the bailout.

Yeah, that bailout that was going to save our economy. The Dow was going to fall under 10,000 if we didn't pass it yesterday.

Oh, yeah, it did anyway.

That WSJ article on the bailout it right on. WTF have I been preaching about the last weeks? No transparency, no trust between banks, no functioning credit market.

We'll get the NEW AND IMPROVED mother of all bailouts (aka the G-TARP or Giant Taxpayer Anal Rape Program) next spring, after the Masters of the Universe suck up the now available $700 billion.

This will be the giant sucking sound that effectively ends any social/health/educational/infrastructure programs proposed by Obama. That money instead will be used to buy up worthless credit swaps and the like, so that the richest among us can get even richer.

And NAO will ensure that no fucking angry rabble will ever be able to put up a real demonstration against this enrichment. Any that do will be labeled "economic terrorists".

Anonymous said...

"At Mid Oregon — which has branches in Bend, Redmond and Prineville, and is building a new branch in Madras — the credit union makes most of its loans for autos and RVs, Anderson said."

I suppose if you're desperate for business you'll do this non-sensical stuff.

Anonymous said...

>>Medians are still higher than when I bought in Dec. 2004. That just seems weird.

That probably won't be the case by the time we're done working through this inventory. A lot of people and a lot of banks have to lose a lot of money before the housing market is anywhere near normal in Bend again.

bruce said...


Now Wall Street may shun $700bn bail-out


* James Doran, New York
* The Observer,
* Sunday October 5 2008

Fears are mounting that many Wall Street banks and financial firms will refuse to participate in the US government's $700bn bail-out package, leaving global markets and world economies in a perilous state for months to come.

'There is a growing feeling that banks ... might instead decide to tough it out,' said Thomas Caldwell, chairman and CEO of Caldwell Financial, a $1bn-plus fund manager.

For the past two weeks all eyes in the market have been focused on US Congress and its attempts to pass Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson's bail-out package - a bill to allow the US government to buy up to $700bn of toxic mortgage-related assets from American banks, which would in theory free the credit markets and set the gears of global commerce spinning once more.

Last Monday, after the bill was thrown out by the House of Representatives, more than $1 trillion was wiped off the value of US stocks as the market was gripped by panic. The bill was passed on Friday afternoon, however, after the inclusion of $149bn of tax breaks and strict rules for participating banks.

But Wall Street analysts, believe the addition of so many terms to the bill might deter potential participants.

One of the least attractive elements is a section designed to curb executive pay at banks that participate in the bail-out package. These include limiting stock-related pay and banning 'golden parachutes' for executives.


'I think this hodge-podge of regulations and rules will be enough to put many [chief executives] off participating,' Caldwell said.

Sources close to Goldman Sachs and Merrill Lynch indicated the banks might choose not to participate in the bail-out as there is a growing view on Wall Street that the market may be bottoming out.

Analysts also believe that the mere presence of the government as buyer of last resort will be enough to get credit markets moving again, and that a large number of banks would not need to take part for the legislation to succeed.

Wall Street ended its worst week in seven years with another tumble on Friday. The Dow Jones Industrial Average closed down more than 157 points on Friday at 10,325.38.


And with the dead cat bounce at the end of today, looks like we'll be down another 600-700 on the Dow, well below 10,000.

"Toughing it out" is the best thing they could do.

BTW, you old farts that love McCain/Palin, did you catch how he plans to pay for those health insurance tax credits?

With 20% cuts to Medicare and Medicaid.

Plus he's going to "fix" social security by giving your funds to Wall St. to manage. You know how smart they are, they'll make sure your trust fund monies go up!

If you still vote for him, you'll get what you deserve.

hbm said...

The idea of the bailout is not to re-inflate the housing bubble. The idea is to keep credit markets from going into lockdown, which would paralyze all business sectors, not just real estate. As far as the housing market goes, you're absolutely right -- it will rebound when prices drop to realistic, affordable levels, not before.

BTW the Dow is now below 10,000 for the first time in five years. HECKUVA JOB, CHUMPY!!!

How come we no longer hear the RepubliCONs telling us how much better off we'd all be if our Social Security payments had gone into the stock market? If there's anything good to come out of this, at least it should lay the bullshit Social Security privatization idea to rest for another 30 years.

Anonymous said...

3yr's out of college, Kashkari, homosexual lover of Paulson to run bailout fund. Brother of Palin they call Kashkari, when it comes to intelligence.

***

The Washington Post reports that Kashkari is a former vice president at Goldman Sachs, where he led the firm's security investment banking practice. Apparently, Kashkari was still a student at Wharton in February, 2002, when the Philadelphia Inquirer reported on his participation in a leadership class exercise. That would put him at no more than six years out of school.

Anonymous said...

Meet the $700 Billion Bailout Czar, Neel Kashkari

There is a new Czar in America -- the man who will be running the $700 billion budget bailout/rescue program -- assistant secretary of the Treasury for International Affairs, Neel Kashkari.

Henry Paulson tapped the company he ran, Goldman Sachs, to hire 35 year old Kashkari, who started as a senior advisor. George W. Bush nominated him as assistant secretary of the Treasury for International Affairs. The appointment was evaluated by the Senate Banking Committee in early June 2008 and approved by the senate on June 27., 2008.

The Wall Street Journal reports that Kashkari's position as czar of the $700 bailout is "interim, pending Senate confirmation. It isn't likely the Senate will move on the matter before the November elections. Mr. Kashkari isn't expected to remain in the post after January, when the Bush administration comes to an end, and,

"Mr. Kashkari was part of the Treasury team that negotiated the asset-repurchase program with Congress, putting in marathon sessions along with Robert Hoyt, Treasury's general counsel, and Kevin Fromer, the head of legislative affairs. He was also one of the originators of the plan. Last year, he and Phillip Swagel, assistant secretary for economic policy, crafted a proposal called 'break the glass' -- referring to the emergency nature of using such a tool -- which envisioned Treasury buying bad loans and other assets.

"Treasury is trying to get the program running as quickly as possible. It is expected to begin soliciting bids from asset managers this week and could hire several managers before the week is over, according to people familiar with the matter. The department plans to hire managers with expertise in the types of securities the government likely will buy, in particular mortgage-backed securities and residential mortgages."

On the US Treasury site, the following profile is provided, which, it seems, has provided the bulk of material several dozen other articles have used to cover who Kashkari is:

Neel Kashkari Senior Advisor

Neel Kashkari is Senior Advisor to U.S. Treasury Secretary Henry M. Paulson, Jr. He provides counsel to the Secretary on key policy matters.

Prior to joining the Treasury Department, Mr. Kashkari was a Vice President at Goldman, Sachs & Co. in San Francisco, where he led Goldman's IT Security Investment Banking practice, advising public and private companies on mergers and acquisitions and financial transactions. Prior to his career in finance, Mr. Kashkari was a R&D Principal Investigator at TRW in Redondo Beach, California where he developed technology for NASA space science missions such as the James Webb Space Telescope.

Originally from Stow, Ohio, Mr. Kashkari graduated from the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign with a Bachelor's and Master's degree in Engineering. He also received an M.B.A. in Finance from the Wharton School. Mr. Kashkari and his wife Minal maintain residences in Maryland and California.

There's not much to be found about Mr. Kashkari beyond the Treasury's brief two paragraph description. Calls to the Senate Banking Committee and the Treasury yielded almost no new information, just promises of callbacks from press people who were not available. One spokesperson did say that the announcement of Kashkari's appointment had just occurred today. While not confirming that the senate banking committee did not know who would be doing this job, with its huge responsibilities, the indication that the announcement had occurred today was in response to a question as to whether the committee had known before approving the bill, who would be managing the bailout.

Here's a link to a C-SPAN video, where he talks about a new kind of mortgage for the US. He comes off as a bright, techno-geek economist kind of man, "smart, articulate, knowledgeable." But he is introduced as being strictly a speaker on "covered mortgages" -- and the audience is instructed not to ask him questions on other topics.

In June 2007, he spoke on the Bush energy policy, and it was reported "he sidestepped most of the prickly issues."

The Washington Post reports that Kashkari is a former vice president at Goldman Sachs, where he led the firm's security investment banking practice. Apparently, Kashkari was still a student at Wharton in February, 2002, when the Philadelphia Inquirer reported on his participation in a leadership class exercise. That would put him at no more than six years out of school.

In 2006, Neel Tushar Kashkari of Stow Ohio was reported to be selected as one of the regional finalists for the White House Fellows Program. A final listing of the actual recipients for 2006-2007 does not include Kashkari.

Kashkari is a 1991 graduate of Western Reserve Academy, a private college prep boarding and day school.

Frankly, it almost seems as though the web has been scrubbed of all background on this man of the hour.

hbm said...

"And it's going to spread to The West Side."

You make it sound like the East Side is the fuckin SOUTH BRONX fer crap's sake. Nobody is getting shot for pocket change here. I'll be very surprised if anybody ever does.

It's true that the West Siders have more class, however. They don't shoot each other in the streets. They just quietly shoot themselves in their HELOC-riddled million-dollar houses.

Anonymous said...

Gunman kills self, five kin over financial woes: Bend Police

48 minutes ago

Bend Oregon (Bulletin) — An unemployed California man shot and killed his wife, three children and mother-in-law before taking his own life over his family's financial difficulties, police said Monday.

Bend Police Department deputy chief Michael Moore said the gunman, 45, shot his wife, 39, her mother, 70, and three sons aged 19, 12 and seven at their home in an upmarket suburb of Los Angeles.

The identities of the family members were not released, but Moore said the gunman was a business school graduate who had held jobs with accountancy firm Price Waterhouse and Sony Pictures before becoming unemployed.

"We believe this individual had become despondent recently over his financial dealings and the financial situation of his household, and this murder-suicide event is a direct result of that," Moore said.

A letter apparently left by the gunman attested to the family's financial difficulties, he said.

Bend, Oregon is one of the worst-hit states in the US home foreclosure crisis, but police said the gunman was not the owner of the home, located in a gated community of Brasada Ranch near Bend, Oregon.

Moore said all of the victims had been shot with a handgun recently bought by the jobless man, who had no history of mental illness or of seeking treatment for mental health problems.

hbm said...

Palin will hammer the 'terrorist connection' and Rev-Wright continually in the coming month.

Rev. Who??? They're tried all that before and they couldn't get any traction with it. This is 2008 and the 'CONs are running as if it was 2004. With the whole country being flushed down the crapper people don't give a fuck about what Obama's pastor said 20 years ago or whether Obama once belonged to the same PTA as some '60s radical. The only people this shit resonates with is the wacko GOP "base."

Anonymous said...

Where are Clinton/Bush/Obama's boyfriends and girlfriends today??

Where Are They Now?

Elliot Abrams--Son-in-law of Commentary editor Norman Podhoretz; convicted in 1991 of unlawfully withholding information from Congress in its investigation of the Iran-Contra affair; pardoned in 1992 by President George H.W. Bush. Currently National Security Council senior director for Near East and North African Affairs, in which capacity he told a regular meeting of Jewish Republicans in May that much of what Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice does on her frequent trips to the Middle East is “just process.”

Cheryl Hanin Bentov (“Cindy”): American-Israeli Mossad agent who in 1986 seduced Israeli nuclear whistleblower Mordechai Vanunu in London, then lured him to Rome, where Mossad agents drugged him and smuggled him back to Israel. Currently lives with her real estate-agent husband and two daughters in an exclusive golf community in Florida, where they moved in 1988, when she was discovered living in the Israeli city of Netanya. The family reportedly maintains a home in Kochav Yair, Israel.

Stephen Bryen--Member of advisory board and former executive director of the Jewish Institute for National Security Affairs (JINSA); as Senate Foreign Relations Committee staff member, was subject of major FBI investigation after being overheard offering documents to Israeli Embassy official Zvi Rafiah; subsequently given top secret clearance and hired in 1981 as his deputy by Richard Perle, then assistant secretary of defense for international security policy. As president of Finmeccanica USA, the U.S. branch of Italy’s largest defense conglomerate which won the contract to build a new version of the presidential Marine One helicopter, Bryen represented the company at the 2005 Iran air show to market his firm’s helicopters.

Adam Ciralsky--CIA contract employee fired in 1999 for failing to reveal a relationship with two U.S.-Isreali employees of Israeli defense firms with possible ties to Israeli intelligence and for failing two polygraph tests about whether he gave or sold U.S. secrets “to an Israeli national.” Subsequently sued the U.S. government for religious discrimination.

John Deutch--Former CIA director whose security clearance was revoked for having prepared top-secret briefings and storing highly classified reference material on his unclassified and unsecured home computer. Facing possible criminal charges, Deutch was pardoned, along with fugitive financier Marc Rich, by President Bill Clinton on his last day in office. Two years later, at an April 2002 Jewish National Fund dinner in honor of Deutch, he was described as “one of Israel’s greatest supporters” who, as deputy defense secretary, helped secure an extra $200 million dollars for the Arrow project. Currently a professor at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology.

Douglas Feith--Former under secretary of defense for policy, he established the Office of Special Plans, which produced “inappropriate” intelligence leading up to the war on Iraq. His subordinate, Larry Franklin, was sentenced to 12 years in prison for passing classified information on Iran to AIPAC’s Steve Rosen and Keith Weissman and an Israeli Embassy official. Feith reportedly lost his security clearance in 1982, when, as a National Security Agency staffer, he came under FBI suspicion for allegedly passing classified material to Israeli Embassy officials. Hired that same year by Richard Perle, then assistant secretary of defense for international security policy, as his special council. After resigning from the Defense Department, he was named a professor at Georgetown University’s Edmund A. Walsh School of Foreign Service, a position which reportedly has not been renewed.

Philip Heymann--Former assistant attorney general in charge of the Justice Department’s Criminal Division, who failed to act on a written recommendation by Deputy Assistant Attorney General Robert Keuch that a grand jury investigate allegations of espionage against Stephen Bryen. As former deputy attorney general under Janet Reno, according to Alan Dershowitz, Heymann was about to recommend a compromise under which President Bill Clinton would reduce Jonathan Pollard’s life sentence so that he could soon be eligible for parole when he was forced to resign for unspecified reasons. Currently James Barr Ames Professor of Law at the Harvard Law School, where he teaches courses on terrorism.

Michael Ledeen--Former New Republic correspondent in Italy, where CIA station files listed him as an agent of influence of a foreign government--Israel; hired in 1981 by Paul Wolfowitz, then head of the State Department’s Policy Planning Staff; hired in 1983 on the recommendation of Richard Perle as a Defense Department consultant on terrorism; subsequently became consultant with the National Security Council, working under Oliver North, who recommended that Ledeen be asked to take periodic polygraph tests; hired as consultant to Pentagon’s Office of Special Plans under Douglas Feith; member with Stephen Bryen and Richard Perle of JINSA board of advisers, and Freedom Scholar at American Enterprise Institute.

Nathan Lewin--Attorney for Stephen Bryen and Larry Franklin; former schoolmate of and Supreme Court clerk with Philip Heymann; advocates the execution of family members of suicide bombers. Currently criminal defense lawyer with Washington, DC firm of Lewin & Lewin.

I. Lewis “Scooter” Libby--Graduate of Yale University, where he studied under Paul Wolfowitz; attorney for fugitive financier Marc Rich when Rich was pardoned by President Clinton; former chief of staff and assistant for national security affairs to Vice President Dick Cheney. Convicted on March 6, 2007 of obstruction of justice, making false statements, and perjury in the investigation into the leaking of former CIA agent Valerie Plame’s identity, Libby’s 30-month sentence was commuted by President George W. Bush on July 2; three days later, Libby paid his $250,000 fine. Between the time of his October 2005 indictment, when he resigned his White House position, and his conviction, Libby served as a senior fellow at the Hudson Institute, a conservative think tank focusing on foreign policy.

Lt. Col. Jeremiah Mattysse--Naval intelligence officer who converted to Judaism and in 2000, carrying several duffel bags containing top-secret information, defected/went AWOL to Israel where, after being missing for two weeks, was located at a hostel in the southern Israeli town of Mitzpe Ramon. He was convinced to return voluntarily to the United States, where he subsequently was relieved of his command.

Richard Perle--As staff member for Sen. Henry “Scoop” Jackson (D-WA), influenced hiring of Paul Wolfowitz by Arms Control and Development Agency; heard on 1969 FBI wiretap discussing classified information with someone at Israeli Embassy in Washington, DC; reportedly received substantial payments for representing an Israeli arms manufacturer; served as Reagan administration assistant secretary of defense from 1981 to 1987. Author, with Michael Ledeen and others, of 1996 paper, “A Clean Break: A Strategy for Securing the Realm,” written for incoming Israeli Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu. Served on the Pentagon’s Defense Policy Board for 17 years before resigning in 2004, having resigned as chairman the previous year over allegations of financial conflicts of interest. Resident fellow at American Enterprise Institute.

David Tenenbaum--Mechanical engineer with U.S. Army’s Tank Automotive and Armaments Command (TACOM), based in Warren, MI, who in 1997 admitted “inadvertently” giving classified U.S. technical data to Israeli officials over a period of 10 years. After a 12-month investigation, the FBI declared the case closed, and Tenenbaum returned to work--although he was not allowed to resume his previous job.

Paul Wolfowitz--While working for the Arms Control and Disarmament Agency, investigated in 1978 for providing to an Israeli government official, through an AIPAC intermediary, a classified document on proposed sale of U.S. weapons to an Arab country; hired in 1990 by then-Defense Secretary Dick Cheney as under defense secretary for policy, in which capacity he promoted the export to Israel of advanced air-to-air missiles; former Bush administration undersecretary of defense for policy overseeing Feith’s Office of Special Plans; along with then-Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, raised the possibility of attacking Iraq the day after Sept. 11, 2001; nominated by President George W. Bush in 2005 as president of World Bank; resigned in 2007 over promotion of his lover, Shaha Riza, a Middle East expert at the bank; currently chair of State Department’s International Security Advisory Board and visiting scholar at American Enterprise Institute.

Anonymous said...

Yeah, that shooter was in LA, not Bend, for the easily startled.

Anonymous said...

What if John McCain were a former president of the Harvard
Law Review?
What if Barack Obama finished fifth from the bottom of his
graduating class?

What if McCain were still married to the first woman he
said "I do" to?
What if Obama were the candidate who left his first wife
after she no longer measured up to his standards?

What if Michelle Obama were a wife who not only became
addicted to pain killers, but acquired them illegally
through her charitable organization?
What if Cindy McCain graduated from Harvard?

What if Obama were a member of the Keating-5*?
* The Keating Five were five United States Senators accused
of corruption in 1989, igniting a major political scandal
as part of the larger Savings and Loan crisis of the late
1980s and early 1990s.

What if McCain were a charismatic, eloquent speaker?

If these questions reflected reality, do you really believe
the election numbers would be as close as they are?

This is what racism does. It covers up, rationalizes and
minimizes positive qualities in one candidate and
emphasizes negative qualities in another when there is a
color difference.

PS: What if Barack Obama had an unwed, pregnant teenage
daughter....

You are The Boss... which team would you hire?

With America facing historic debt, 2 wars, stumbling health
care, a weakened dollar, all-time high prison population,
mortgage crises, bank foreclosures, etc:

Educational Background:
Obama:
Columbia University - B.A. Political Science with a
Specialization in International Relations.
Harvard - Juris Doctor (J.D.) Magna C#m Laude

Biden:
University of Delaware - B.A. in History and B.A. in
Political Science.
Syracuse University College of Law - Juris Doctor (J.D.)

vs.

McCain:
United States Naval Academy - Class rank: 894 of 899

Palin:
Hawaii Pacific University - 1 semester
North Idaho College - 2 semesters - general study
University of Idaho - 2 semesters - journalism
Matanuska-Susitna College - 1 semester
University of Idaho - 3 semesters - B.A. in Journalism

bruce said...

So remind me again, that list of neocon assholes--I know most all of them worked in the Bush administration, but which one's exactly, are on the Obama advisory team?

Re: Neel Kashkari

That is stunning. Putting a 35 year old kid in charge of this thing is absolutely stunning.

And when you Google him, it's almost as if his background has been scrubbed. The college he went to doesn't even list him as an alumni.

This doesn't smell too good.

Anonymous said...

Re: Neel Kashkari

That is stunning. Putting a 35 year old kid in charge of this thing is absolutely stunning.

*

PAULSON is going down good, and so is BUSH, nobody else will touch this new bailout firm, as their are 'pay limits'.

Truth is this was Paulson's boyfriend from his Goldman Sachs days. Paulson likes young men, much like Bush.

Anonymous said...

Palin & Kashkari have the same amount of experience.

There is a pattern here.

bruce said...

Quote of the day:

'"Did they yell out "show us your boobs?"'

Regarding Palin's attacks on Obama in Florida that resulted in a shout of out "Kill him!"

That would just destroy her: protestors drunkenly chanting "Show us your boobs!"

I'm smiling just thinking of the scene...

Anonymous said...

Ahhh...where did it all go wrong? Perhaps it was when the American dream of home ownership turned into the American Promise of Wealth. Scary times my friends...This is one decade they'll be studying for years to come.

Anonymous said...

PALIN IS A CLOSET NAZI, WHO WOULD HAVE GUESSED??


Palin Quoted Antisemitic Author in RNC Speech

Sarah Palin scares the Jews! From her crazy Jew-converting church to emails your grandmother is receiving right now, it's clear that America's Jews are nervous about this woman. Just ask Ed Koch! This won't help: remember Palin's address to the Republican National Convention? That bit of speechcraft so inspiring that it is already being taught in schools alongside Dr. King's Dream Speech and Billy Crystal's second Oscars monologue? It turns out one of its few memorable non-Obama-attacking lines was lifted from an old anti-Semite so extreme that he was booted from the John Birch Society.

It is, honestly, a bizarre and inexplicable story. "We grow good people in our small towns," Palin said, quoting someone identified only as a writer, "with honesty and sincerity and dignity." That "writer," Wall Street Journal columnist Thomas Frank notes, is a man named Westbrook Pegler. You have probably never heard of him, but he was a very popular and very right-wing columnist from the first half of the 20th century. How right-wing? He openly wished for the assassination of Franklin Roosevelt, for one.

And for two, he was quite the anti-Semite! He hated Jews so much, the far-right anti-Semitic John Birch Society banned him from their journal. And all Pegler did was claim that American Jews were "instinctively sympathetic to Communism"! And also claim lots of other crazy stuff!

So. Quoting an old anti-Semite is obviously proof of nothing—people still say nice things about Lindbergh, Henry Ford, Walt Disney, and Richard Nixon—but the larger question here is who put those words in her nice speech, where did they find them, and what the hell were they thinking. Like... did they think no one would notice? Who even reads Pegler anymore?

Answer: Pat Buchanan! Buchanan, that lovable old coot, used that same line in a 1990 book. Buchanan, of course, did not mind being associated with a crazy old anti-Semite, and the passage was quoted in a section quite complimentary to the reactionary columnist.

It really does boggle the mind, doesn't it, that they could not find another passage by another writer talking about how nice small towns are, right? Of course the line is question is also about Harry Truman, who was, of course, a Vice President who eventually became president when the guy before him died in office of old age, so really there are a lot of questions we have for the people who composed that terrible speech.

Anonymous said...

Even Palin has Karl Rove telling her what to say, do, and where to shit, when to wear he heels, and when to take on/off the gloves.

*

New York, 12:21 6 oct 2008
The Man Who Programmed Sarah Palin

Sarah Palin burst on to the national scene with that lovely speech about how Barack Obama wasted his time helping "communities" while she personally destroyed the Bridge Over the River Nowhere. Everyone loved it, and the nation fell in love with the cheerfully bitchy makeup-plastered trollop. Ever since that day, every time we see Sarah Palin she is delivering the exact same speech, in the exact same cadence. It was so good she never bothered to find a second thing to read into microphones! But there are some oddities with the remarks that made her famous. Like, who wrote it? Bush speechwriter Matt Scully is credited with it, but some of it seems a bit at odds with his typical work. Like the person delivering it, and the bit with the reactionary old anti-Semite that was thrown in there.

Who's Matt Scully? Time explains:

A veteran of the early Bush White House, his specialty was crafting Bush's pro-life message in a way that would not offend soccer moms or mainstream Catholics who get nervous around some of the more extreme Evangelical rhetoric. A former protégé of the late pro-life Democratic governor of Pennsylvania, Bob Casey, Scully has a history of finding rhetorical unity for voters on the right and in the center.

They also say Scully wrote the speech largely before Palin was selected. Which makes sense. But the parts that seemed tailored specifically to her? Who wrote those? Specifically, the line about small towns, and how they grow great people? That line, as was revealed this week, was written by a very bigoted columnist named Westbrook Pegler. That line seems like a landmine of unintentional readings: it was written by a racist, about a man who became president when the old man before him died. Not really a single good interpretation there, right?

Well either someone more wacky and right-wing than Scully got a hold of the speech before it was delivered (possible!), or Scully sabotaged her. Hear us out!

Scully left the Bush administration pissed off at his fellow speechwriter Mike Gerson and willing to settle scores in the pages of the liberal Atlantic. He wrote a book about animal rights and how he came to be a fairly militant vegetarian. The book is about how we humans have abused our God-granted "dominion" over the animals. He even opposes many hunting practices! Including, say, hunting wolves from fucking airplanes.

So. Michael Scully either put his party before his sense of morality and wrote a "red meat" speech for a wolf huntress, or someone else got in there and fixed it before Palin delivered it, or Scully bit his tongue and inserted a line by a long-dead far-right extremist that he found in an ancient Pat Buchanan book. Which, from the guy who crafted the "compassionate conservative" "different kind of Republican" message of Bush's 2000 campaign, seems an odd source to borrow from.

Also, when will anyone besides bloggers and Thomas Frank mention the Pegler quote or

Anonymous said...

Also, when will anyone besides bloggers and Thomas Frank mention the Pegler quote or track down Scully for an interview?

Anonymous said...

Even Fox has their Palin 'truth'.

*

Palin as "ready" as Truman was

By Michael Moriarty
web posted October 6, 2008

Humphrey Bogart, in the film Casablanca, when asked by a Nazi where he came from, says "New York" and then the great star suggests that there are parts of New York City that Nazis shouldn't venture into.

Racial supremacism and its growing American equivalent, Progressive Intellectual Supremacism that endorses abortion, an elitism shared among both the Democratic and the Republican pundits -- racism and intellectual supremacism are interrelated phenomena -- both equally antithetical to "all men are created equal".
Potsdam meeting
Meeting at Potsdam, Germany, July 28-August 1, 1945
Front: British Prime Minister Clement Atlee, U.S. President Harry S. Truman, Soviet Premier Joseph Stalin
Second row: Fleet Admiral William D. Leahy, USN, Truman's Chief of Staff, British Foreign Minister Ernest Bevin, U.S. Secretary of State James F. Byrnes, Soviet Foreign Minister Vyacheslav Molotov

The inventor of Joseph Stalin's "Molotov Cocktail" – Vyacheslav Molotov, when he was first confronted by FDR's replacement, Harry Truman, was unmistakably insulted by the new President. Molotov expressed dismay over Truman who basically told the Red terrorist to cut the cow litter and wipe off the mask of good intentions. Harry knew all along how evil both Molotov and Stalin were.

Sarah Palin knows exactly how evil and threatening Vladimir Putin's neo-Soviet Russia is and, rather like the corn-fed, Midwestern, middle-class Truman, Sarah called a snake a snake … and did so rather deftly in her interview with Katie Couric.

"As Putin raises his head", is how she put it.

Harry knew that Molotov was a snake and Sarah knows that Putin is a snake. Both Putin and Molotov are now known as deadly reptiles.

You can take a man out of the KGB, but you can't take the KGB out of Vladimir Putin.

Harry Truman only lasted one full term as elected President. He was ejected from the Oval Office for having fired Douglas MacArthur, having not freed North Korea and for having lost China to the Communists and Mao Tse Tung. Such eventualities, under the "enlightened" leadership of an increasingly Progressive Democratic Administration (despite the firing of previous and publicly admitted Progressive Vice-President Henry A. Wallace), these "Progressive Concessions" -- they proved to be anathema to the central meaning of America and the American people … then!

Sarah PalinWith Sarah Palin as a possible Truman -- and without the Progressive agendas of the FDR appeasement policies of Dean Acheson and Averell Harriman, the McCain Presidency cannot only face Red Islam of Communist-backed Muslim extremists, but also have a Harry Truman in Sarah Palin to finish the job. In short, a great American woman can defeat a Communist-backed Islamic male any day.

Who would be best to chat with a Vladimir Putin when he "raises his head?" A master of Progressive "Change" such as Obama or a female Harry Truman that is devoid of the "Progressive suggestions" from the likes of Dean Acheson and Averell Harriman?

The McCain Presidency cannot only face the Red Islam of Communist-backed Muslim extremists, but also have a Harry Truman in Sarah Palin to finish the job.

In conclusion, CNN's and Newsweek's Fareed Zakaria and his Charlie Gibson-like, down-his-own-nose examination and estimation of Sarah Palin is intended to be the justifiable "coup de grace", the death blow so well prepared for by Progressive contract-hitters like Maureen Dowd and Judith Warner … not to mention the recent, in-house Republican dismissals of Palin.

The Progressive 1-2-3 punch of Zakaria, Dowd and Warner, the shared political harmony between the New York Times and Newsweek, effectively confirms these publications' preference for Obama as the re-instatement of Rooseveltian appeasement policies toward Vladimir Putin's neo-Soviet Russia. Because of that, Iran's nuclear ambitions will be tacitly condoned, along with the renewed, nuclear efforts of North Korea.

Zakaria, however, was forced to admit that Sarah Palin is a "feisty, charismatic politician who has done some good".

Sounds like a description of early Harry Truman to me … and what major foreign policy credentials did Harry Truman have before America entered World War II? He certainly knew how to cut corruption in the military-industrial complex.

Harry now sounds like a Palin-maverick to me.

In the end, perhaps the 2008 primaries and election were just a rehearsal for both Sarah Palin and Hillary Clinton. By 2012, they will be facing off in that presidential election.

I think the female Harry Truman's experiences as mayor, governor and VP candidate will have sunk into the American mentality far enough for them to realize that Sarah Palin did it mainly by herself … without any help from Bill Clinton.

In addition, should Palin become President, she would … unlike Harry Truman … govern without the likes of Henry A. Wallace Progressives surrounding her.

Finally, judging from the recent Vice-Presidential debate, Joe Biden is no Harry Truman. Harry would have known the difference between Hezbollah and Syria.

"Give ‘em hell, Sarah!" ESR

mike said...

For all of the Bend locals that have lived there before 1986 try to see this economy meltdown as a blessing in diguise because it will get rid of all these liberal Cali-banger sons-a-bitches that have raped the place. I came back to Bend after being in AZ for 12 years last fall and was stunned at what I saw. I rented a 172 and flew over the tri-counties and got a birds view of the damage done by these idots that will vote for the Obamination ticket thinking that it is all the Republicans doing and none of them, especially the young voters will know the history of Fannie Mae / Freddie Mac that started with that Fucking FDR. So Lehman's Fuld was punched out in the Lehman gym I read today. Maybe Barney Frank will get it next, as well as the biggest ASSHOLE of all, Shumer. As I flew over the west side I could see how a fire just like the Awbrey hall blaze could take out all of the high buck shit west of the butte. Please post more info as to how fast those jerks are moving out. This time as Bend returns to being a tough town to make a living, it will be even harder as there will not be the mill to sustain a basic economy. When the people that started this blog tell you all that it is going to be tough times in Bend, well most of you have no idea as to how tough it can be there if you have no income. I said INCOME as most people only have an IFCOME and those poor slobs are only 24 hrs from not having a job. I also read where some coward in SoCal shot his entire family today because he was despondent over his financial situation. Keep your ears open and be ready to duck down low as the round go off in a location near you.

Anonymous said...

BP/HOMER ( well homer is the idiot ), this is a must read. 'Paper' can now be translated directly into deposits now, as nobody is any longer buying paper aka SIV's. Note the money market assets are SIV's, and they can't pay redemptions because you can't sell SIV's, so teh treasury is now paying cash for the SIV's. This is what the bailout was for all along, never for housing MTG so said by homer, et-al, this has always been about worthless paper 100's of Trillions of worthless paper.

****

The Wall Street Journal

Oct. 7, 2008
The Fed announced a plan to purchase commercial paper directly from issuers. The Treasury Department will make a special deposit at the Fed to back the facility. The Fed said the new facility will provide a "liquidity backstop" by purchasing three-month unsecured and asset-backed commercial paper directly from issuers. The commercial paper market has been hit by an unwillingness among money market investors to hold risky assets.

Anonymous said...

How about $14 Trillion, or even $140 Trillion, worthless paper with NO buyer is still what it is, at some point printing Trillions of T-BILL's or Fed-Res-Notes, makes even that currency as fashionable as SIV's, & CSD's.

***

IMF Urges Coordinated Action, Sees US Losses at $1.4 Trillion
Wall Street Journal - 29 minutes ago
By TOM BARKLEY WASHINGTON -- With losses on bad US assets alone expected to top $1.4 trillion, the International Monetary Fund urged global policy makers Tuesday to coordinate a response to an unprecedented financial crisis that continues to spread.
IMF warns of deeper slowdown amid crisis Reuters
IMF in 'severe downturn' warning BBC News

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

That would just destroy her: protestors drunkenly chanting "Show us your boobs!"

Not if they're nice. That might save this thing from total defeat.

I'm smiling just thinking of the scene...

Me too.

Anonymous said...

INSIDE HANK PAULSON'S DIARY

What a roller-coaster ride! As it turns out, we got what we wanted: the $700 billion bailout fund, but it came at quite a price. True, the potential catastrophe is real, but lots of economists and pundits saw the housing meltdown, credit squeeze and derivatives disaster coming long ago and yet the politicians, especially we Republicans, did nothing. They were like me, true believers in the glories of the unregulated free market, terrified that by proposing tight government regulation, we'd kill the goose that was laying all those golden eggs. We all were in a major state of denial. We knew that the economic good times were resting on flimsy foundations and eventually would come crashing down, but we didn't want to prepare for that disaster. We all hoped the catastrophe would happen on someone else's watch. We were so comfortable, so deluded by greed, we just wanted the free ride to go on forever, so we looked away.

The consequence of waiting too long is that the whole capitalist financial system may come tumbling down on our heads, along with our social/political structure as we know it. On the other hand -- as Naomi Klein knows with her "shock doctrine/disaster capitalism" theory -- when a disaster strikes, there's opportunity for massive political and economic changes that benefit those that have. We're not even very subtle about it with this bailout, with virtually nothing but maybe some trickle-down for the "collateral damage" victims of the various financial schemes. But they don't really have a viable set of leaders or way of protesting. I love this system!

Yes, we suffered an embarrassing defeat when the hot-under-the-collar Republicans in the House turned down our bill, but we turned it around four days later. However, the damage was done, not the least being that the huge fissures in the Republican party were brought to the surface, and none of our actions reflected well on our candidate and party. As a result of that and his own ineffective grandstanding, McCain is tanking steadily in the polls.

The saving grace is that when Obama takes over in January, he's going to have to deal with the two biggest messes in modern American history, courtesy of u s Republicans: Iraq and the fallout from the bailout, and there's no way he can do anything more than simply tread water in that roiling ocean. Sorry, Barack. Hee, hee, hee. He won't have any money to implement any of his libral reforms and initiatives, so the public will get fed up with him and the Democrat party early and return Republicans to power in 2010 in Congress and 2012 in the White House.

I don't envy Obama's Herculean tasks. And he won't be able to talk his way out of any of those messes with high-flown oratory. He's stuck in our Republican molasses. For the sake of the country, I hope he can keep the situation relatively stable and that things won't get much worse, or else the anger and hopelessness may well spill over into calls for revolution. FDR had to face many of the same problems in the 1930s, but I don't think Obama has the experience and political smarts to be another FDR.

...We've got two immediate problems to deal with in the bailout:

Number One: While we are getting our rescue infrastructure up and running, the rescue operation won't really kick in for another couple of months, maybe the cash (and then freed-up credit) won't even start flowing until next year. During that lag-time, the credit squeeze will get worse, not better, and that could send the country into another Great Depression. (Already two of our largest states, California and Massachusetts, have announced that they need many billions of dollars in bridge loans just to get by until anticipated tax revenues arrive next year. And there are a dozen other states lined up right behind those two.)

Number Two: We really don't know if our plan will work. What if we buy up all this toxic paper and we pay the wrong price and lose most of it or can't unload it to buyers? It's mainly my plan and even I'm not sure it will do what we hope it will do. That's what keeps me up at night. Figure of speech. I've got mine, Jack, and I sleep just fine.

We made all sorts of concessions to get the damn bill passed, including strong regulation of the financial markets, and had to add $150 billion of this "Monopoly" money for local pork projects to buy the votes we needed. We're in hock up to our eyeballs and beyond. Who knows? Just to survive, we may wind up selling key parts of the American economy to the Chinese.

As Tiny Tim would have said: "God help us, everyone."

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

Divine downtown

Shop owner creates luscious living space above her store

I guarantee you Mountain Comfort is NOT doing well these days.

I admire this gals accomplishments, but her business, like many around here, is built on Bubble-levels of business. This "lull" is NOT temporary... it IS Bend. It's Old Skool Bend, an economic nightmare of high unemployment, low wage jobs. This ain't no lull. This is how it's going to be... FOREVER.

Anonymous said...

Subject of HOA Investigation Commits Suicide


Retired Bend Police Lieutenant Chris Van Cleef died of what appears to be a self-inflicted gunshot wound Tuesday morning.
Retired Metro Police Lieutenant Chris Van Cleef died of what appears to be a self-inflicted gunshot wound Tuesday morning.
Agents served search warrants at several locations, seeking evidence to link local attorneys and contractors to HOA's all over the Deschutes County.

Agents served search warrants at several locations, seeking evidence to link local attorneys and contractors to HOA's all over the valley.
Attorney Nancy Quon is signed up to teach classes to future homeowner association managers.
Attorney Nancy Quon is signed up to teach classes to future homeowner association managers.
A former police officer named as a potential target in an ongoing HOA corruption probe died Tuesday in an apparent suicide.

Retired Bend Police Lieutenant Chris Van Cleef died of what appears to be a self-inflicted gunshot wound Tuesday morning. The circumstances surrounding his death are under investigation but it certainly looks like a suicide according to law enforcement sources.

Van Cleef spent years with Bend City Police and retired as a Lieutenant in 2005 after getting nabbed in Utah for a DUI. His name and that of two other former Bend Officers, surfaced last week in the massive FBI-Metro investigation into alleged corruption within local homeowner association boards.

Agents served search warrants at several locations, seeking evidence to link local attorneys and contractors to HOA's all over the Deschutes County.

One warrant was served at DRW Communities, which is owned by the ex-wife of a current Metro Officer.

Lawmen think the outside interests conspired to take over the homeowner boards so that expensive repairs and lucrative construction defect lawsuits could be channeled to particular co-conspirators.

Van Cleef was elected to the board of the DR Creek Homeowner Association. DR Creek is one of the developments which is at the heart of the investigation.

No charges have been filed, but pressure is growing and sources close to the probe say the potential targets appear to be turning on each other.

There's also an interesting twist elsewhere in the unfolding story -- as federal agents and local police pursue leads against Las Vegas law firms and contractors, some of those very same potential targets are teaching courses for the state.

Attorney Nancy Quon, who specializes in construction defects lawsuits and whose name has been linked to several of the HOA's now under suspicion, is signed up to teach classes to future homeowner association managers in a program authorized and promoted by the State of Oregon Real Estate Division.

The schedule shows Quan and her partners teaching courses in community management principles and in construction defects lawsuits. Also listed on the schedule is at least one contractor named in the search warrants served last week.

Whether those classes will continue as scheduled now that Quon and others have been served with warrants will be a decision for real estate officials to make.

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

Subject of HOA Investigation Commits Suicide

Here's the source on that...

Anonymous said...

Meth, Bend, & Real Estate don't mix.

***

Man guilty in slaying of his real estate agent

7:27 a.m. Oct 7, 2008

The Bulletin, Bend Oregon

Deschutes COUNTY COURTS: A Bend man was found guilty of second-degree murder yesterday for killing his real estate agent in a dispute over a condominium deal.

Michael Ray Jennison, 38, was convicted in Deschutes County Court of shooting real estate agent James Magot twice in the head in February 2007 after a scuffle in a Powell Butte Boulevard condominium Jennison inherited from his grandmother.

Magot, 64, wanted to buy the condominium for himself, but Jennison wanted to sell it to a neighbor, who saw the shooting.

Jennison's lawyer, Brian White, urged the jury to convict Jennison of voluntary manslaughter, which carries a maximum sentence of 20 years in prison. Jennison is facing a life sentence with a murder conviction.

White said Jennison has been diagnosed with a paranoid personality disorder as a result of an abusive upbringing by an alcoholic, drug-addicted mother and then by abusive grandparents. Because of his mental condition, Jennison was incapable of controlling his actions, White said. –R.H.

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

Sunriver Resort lays off 17 senior managers

By Nina Mehlhaf, KTVZ.COM

Seventeen upper-level employees at Sunriver Resort packed up their desks Monday after being laid-off, in a cost-cutting move the resort says had to happen to stay afloat.

Really? Sounds like they are saying the resort is close to insolvency.

Got Bubble?

Anonymous said...

Tenant arrested in Columbus real estate agent's death in court this morning
Herta Bailey, 70, found dead Tuesday in car trunk
BY LILY GORDON -
--
Bend Police Chief Ricky Boren holds a news conference at the Public Safety Center on Wednesday to announce the arrest of Rickey L. Powell in the slaying of local real estate agent Herta Bailey.
Shannon Szwarc
Bend Police Chief Ricky Boren holds a news conference at the Public Safety Center on Wednesday to announce the arrest of Rickey L. Powell in the slaying of local real estate agent Herta Bailey.
Herta Bailey Ricky Powell

When Rickey Leo Powell left Herta Bailey's office Monday evening she was alive. At least that's what he told police.

Bend police Detective Drew Tynor told a different story in Recorder's Court this morning.

Powell, 39, was arrested Tuesday night and charged in the slaying of the 70-year-old Bend realtor who was found Tuesday evening strangled in the trunk of her car. What led police to Powell was a stolen credit card and some good investigative work.

Bend police say Powell used Bailey's Visa credit card to pay at least three utility bills, one to the Columbus Water Works and the others to Atmos Energy and Georgia Power. Investigators said that after obtaining a security camera video of Powell making one of those payments, they first confirmed his identity then obtained a warrant for financial transaction fraud.

Almost simultaneaously, another team of detectives were working to establish a connection between Bailey and a client she was supposed to meet Monday evening at a real estate office on Franklin Road according to her appointment book. The client was penned into her book under the name Riley Powell. By cross-referencing the name Herta Bailey with Riley Powell, investigators were able to establish that Bailey owned a piece of rental property in Bend on Pine Deschutes Drive that she leased to a man name Rickey Powell.

"They came to the conclusion they needed to talk to Rickey Powell," Tynor said.

A search warrant in hand, police staked out Powell's home at 5264 Pine Needle Drive. He was arrested about 9 p.m. and held for financial transaction fraud.

Tynor testified in court this morning that as officers were escorting Powell from his home, one of the detectives asked him if there was anywhere else they should go. Powell said there was.

He led them "turn by turn. Step by step" to the 1300 block of 51st Street where Bailey's silver Ford Mustang was parked. He then told them where to find her body, Tynor said.

Powell denies having anything to do with Bailey's murder. He said when he left her office after their meeting, where Bailey allegedly told him she was going to evict him for not paying his rent, he ran into two friends. One went by the name of "Birdman," Tynor said. Powell told police his friends said they were going to speak with Bailey about rental property. A short time later, Birdman stopped by Powell's home, he told police, and gave him Bailey's credit card which he allegedly used to pay some utility bills.

Powell also told police it was Birdman and the his other friend who told him where to find Bailey's car and body, Tynor testified.

Powell pleaded not guilty to all four charges against him. He receieved no bond on the murder and kidnapping charges while the judge assessed him a $25,000 bond for the financial transaction fraud and motor vehicle theft. His case was bound over to Superior Court.

Upon exiting the courtroom, Bailey's daughter, Tina Womack, wiped the tears from her eyes and said she's glad Powell will be held without bond. She thanked the Bend Police Department for their hard work on this case and expressed relief that the judicial process has begun.

mike said...

At least Van Cleef chose not to kill his entire family or co-workers. Another interesting statistic would be the rise in handgun and shotgun sales in Central OR. Ah yes, the Bend of "the good ol days" is coming soon. I am wondering what will happen to all of these homes that have been built ???

Anonymous said...

Sunriver Resort Hires 17 senior Real Estate Marketing & Sales Managers Plans to Build Worlds Largest Water Slide.

***


Tom O'Shea, managing director of Sunriver Resort, says layoffs were the most painful business decision he's had to make

Visitors still coming - they're just not spending as much

By Nina Mehlhaf, KTVZ.COM

Seventeen upper-level employees at Sunriver Resort packed up their desks Monday after being laid-off, in a cost-cutting move the resort says had to happen to stay afloat.

Like many other businesses, Sunriver officials say the struggling economy has forced them to make some hard decisions. With nearly 500 year-round employees, this layoff only represents a small percentage, but the cuts come from some of the biggest salaries.

"It's very tough, it's hard. Business is off," said Tom O'Shea, managing director of the resort.

There's no sugar coating it, businesses of every kind can't escape what's happening. The tightening of the belt at Sunriver Resort started at the first of the year.

"It really started to spike around the time gas prices stated to go off the chart and that's when we started to realize it's not going to be the same year as it was in the past," O'Shea said.

The past three months have been spent looking at which employees to let go. In the nd, 17 senior-level positions from manager to director, from 10 years with the company to less than a year, were laid off.

They are some of the highest salaried personnel, and that will save Sunriver serious money when even the beauty of the High Desert can't make visitors shell out the dough.

"It's not a matter of people coming to stay at Sunriver," O'Shea said. "It's when they do come to Sunriver, they're not spending as much as they would in the past."

Things change fast. It was only back in August when NewsChannel 21 did a story highlighting the economic boom the Jeld-Wen Tradition golf tournament brought the area: a $10 million direct impact to business, hotels and restaurants from 30,000 visitors.

But the drop-off since, thanks to fears about this economy, isn't just at Sunriver. Black Butte Ranch says while no layoffs are imminent, the 90 full-time employees there have been on their toes as budgets tighten and the ranch gets more cost-efficient.

Both say it's not just middle-class families who are cutting back. It's also the top-tier wealthy feeling the slump as well.

"Business is off, it's off throughout. And it just became obvious that it's not going to change," O'Shea said.

Sunriver is offering those employees severance packages. One of the last layoffs at Sunriver was back in 2001.

--

Here's the full text of Monday's announcement by resort Managing Director Tom O'Shea:

There is not a business in this region that hasn't been impacted by the current economic climate affecting this country. Due to the weakened economy, Sunriver Resort has conducted an evaluation of our entire organization - including resort operations, real estate, golf and club operations, and development - in an effort to identify areas where we might be able to be more efficient as an organization.

The result of this evaluation is the elimination of 17 positions within the company, effective Monday, October 6. These layoffs are by no means a reflection of individual job performance. These decisions were difficult to make, but I believe the changes provide the best operating structure for Sunriver Resort at this time in light of the current economic situation.

We are confident that these changes will have no impact on daily resort operations, and that owners, guests, and members at Sunriver Resort, Crosswater, and Caldera Springs will continue to enjoy the quality and service they have come to expect from us.

Sunriver Resort's ability to succeed through the economic peaks and valleys of the past 40 years has largely been a result of our ability to adapt to changing market conditions, and this is no exception. As a result, Sunriver Resort is continually among the region's largest employers, with 485 year-round employees and a staff of more than 1,000 during peak seas

Anonymous said...

Subject of HOA Investigation Commits Suicide

Here's the source on that ...

*

Let's remember that in BEND the 100% of the HOA franchise is owned by ex Mayor Friedman.

Anonymous said...

From KOA, now Back to KOA
...
Shop owner creates luscious living space above her store
By Penny Nakamura / For The Bulletin
Published: October 07. 2008 4:00AM PST
DeeDee and Mark Keith’s condo has two levels of deck that overlook downtown Bend.
more photos more photos | order photo

DeeDee and Mark Keith’s condo has two levels of deck that overlook downtown Bend.
Melissa Jansson / The Bulletin
advertisement:
Comment on this article:

We welcome comments from subscribers (E-Edition or print). Comments are solely the responsibility of those who post them; their viewpoints are not endorsed by The Bulletin or bendbulletin.com. The Bulletin and bendbulletin.com reserve the right to refrain from publishing or to remove posts that include foul language, personal or abusive attacks, or are off-topic. Posts will be signed with the first and last initial and home city associated with the subscriber's account; the subscriber's address, phone and e-mail address will remain private, as noted in our privacy policy. Read the full commenting policy before you post.
Click here to comment

DeeDee Keith jokes that she always promised Karma, her dog, that some day she would get them a better place to live.

And boy did she deliver, going from living out of a trailer at a KOA campground to becoming a successful Bend businesswomen

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

Countries bailing out other countries...

Notice it ain't us. It's Russia, our newly enriched & combative "ally". They have money. We do not.

Russia backing Iceland as world crisis spreads


By Omar Valdimarsson and Keith Weir 50 minutes ago

REYKJAVIK/LONDON (Reuters) - Russia negotiated an emergency bailout for Iceland and unveiled an aid package for its own banks on Tuesday, while Japan called for greater coordination in tackling the global financial crisis.
ADVERTISEMENT

The International Monetary Fund increased its estimate of global losses from the financial meltdown to $1.4 trillion and warned that the world's economic downturn was deepening.

"The financial planet is in total crisis," European Central Bank Governing Council member Guy Quaden said, capturing a mood of disarray in governments and markets alike.

bruce said...

Re: Sounds like a description of early Harry Truman to me … and what major foreign policy credentials did Harry Truman have before America entered World War II?...I think the female Harry Truman's experiences as mayor, governor and VP candidate will have sunk into the American mentality far enough for them to realize that Sarah Palin did it mainly by herself

Via Wiki: Truman was a two-term Senator and Vice-President, before taking office when Roosevelt died after three months.

Quimby said...

>> "It's not a matter of people coming to stay at Sunriver," O'Shea said. "It's when they do come to Sunriver, they're not spending as much as they would in the past."

The magical mystery housing ATM has been unplugged.

I got nosey recently and looked up a couple of acquaintances in the Deschutes Co recordings system. My god, was everyone refi'ing and taking HELOCs? The thought never crossed my mind as that is pure financial insanity! Pay that sucker off and live within your means people.

A sucker born every minute.

Anonymous said...

Hey mike you a-hole. don't come back to Bend. It's was good-riddance that you left. It's a better town without you.

Anonymous said...

We don't need anymore dipshit GOP apologists in this town.

Anonymous said...

Bend Homeless man has wheelchair stolen

Reported by: Bend Bulletin, 7 Oct 2008

Bend, Oregon, -- A homeless Vietnam veteran is recovering from injuries he sustained during a robbery last week.
64 year old Richard Denise was attacked while he was sleeping behind the Bank of America at 200 W Wall Street in Bend.

Denise was hit with a wooden board.
The homeless vet had his money and his wheelchair stolen.
The Deschutes County Sheriff's office is investigating the crime.

DSC reports that Denise has been using the chair since he was wounded during the Vietnam war.
A good samaritan has donated another wheelchair to Richard Denise.

The suspect is described as a white male, between 45-50 years old, about 5’11”-6’ tall, with medium length blonde hair that he slicks back, a tattoo possibly on the right arm, clean shaven and speaks with a CALIFORNIA accent. The suspect was last seen wearing a blue shirt and blue jeans. The T-Shirt was emblazoned with a local realtors name.

Anonymous said...

REYKJAVIK/LONDON (Reuters) - Russia negotiated an emergency bailout for Iceland and unveiled an aid package for its own banks on Tuesday, while Japan called for greater coordination in tackling the global financial crisis.

*

Iceland's economy is in the pit's they got cut off from INTL loans months ago, yes its quite interesting that Russia be the last resort.

That said this 'special relationship' could place a nice base in the middle of the Atlantic between EU & USA. Nice move I say, on Russia's part.

The US power is collapsing so fucking fast.

Anonymous said...

Bank America lost 20% today, ...

The strong are starting to look weak.

Anonymous said...

The suspect is described as a white she-male, between 45-50 years old, about 5’11”-6’ tall, with medium length blonde hair that he slicks back, a tattoo possibly on the right arm, clean shaven and speaks with a CALIFORNIA accent. The suspect was last seen wearing a blue shirt and blue jeans. The T-Shirt was emblazoned with a local realtor name 'Breeze'.

*

She-Males, Bend, & Breeze, ...

Anonymous said...

Looks like we got some unemployed Cali-bangers online Mikey. Keep up the good work.

Anonymous said...

I couldn't care less about Cali, Or, Samoan, whatever. Anyone who spouts that GOP propaganda is an idiot and I say good riddance.

Anonymous said...

And the same goes for the Demo party propaganda here? I don't see you telling HBM or BP to fuck off.

Anonymous said...

I don't see you telling HBM or BP to fuck off.

*

If you start sucking cock, then you too will not be told to fuck off.

Anonymous said...

We don't need anymore dipshit GOP apologists in this town.

*

This is a self enforcing troll. Only a PUG would call REPUG's as 'GOP' the GOP is now the word, as PUG means BUSH, and GOP means Palin/McCain.

GOP is the new party of the future, Pug & Dem is the old.

Yeh, right, and I have a bridge to sell you on I97.

GOP ( PUG ) apologists are Bend, BP & HBM have always been a FUCKING minority in this town. Want fucking Lib's? Think Eugene, this ain't Eugene this is BEND, PUG-TOWN.

HOMER(BUTTER) is a PUG, ... most of the indy's here are PUG, but when they call themselves GOP, you know they have already signed on to O'Reilly/Limbaugh marching orders.

A PUG is a GOP, they are McSAME.

Grand Ole Pederast's they are, but they're still Pug's.

The DEM's in Bend are so fucking few, that they might as well be considered extinct, as they simply never existed in this old mill/ranching town.


The Lib's are in the valley, think Portland, Eugene, or Corvallis, all college towns.

Bend is PALIN-VILLE, the home of the un-educated soccer-mom, with a big SUV, and a BIG mouth.

Anonymous said...

Demo party propaganda here? I don't see you telling HBM or BP to fuck off.

*

Everytime OUR resident PUSSY's post something here from Daily-Kos, they are told to fuck-off, given that you don't know that means you be a Newbie. Which is lower than pussy.

Anonymous said...

Wife Of Slain Bend Developer Battles Insurers At Trial

By DAVE ALTIMARI ( Bend Bulletin )
October 6, 2008

The men suspected in the 2006 slaying of Bend real estate developer Andrew Kissel are awaiting trial, but Kissel's wife is now fighting her own legal battle against insurance companies intent on recovering millions they say she owes them for her role in her late husband's illegal schemes.

Hayley Wolff Kissel participated in her husband's plots to steal money from a Redmond City co-op apartment and to defraud creditors by transferring property in Washington to her name, Fidelity National Title Insurance and Chicago Title Insurance say in their lawsuit.

The companies issued title insurance to several banks that gave Andrew Kissel mortgages based on documents that authorities said he had falsified. When he was killed, Kissel was days from pleading guilty to forging documents to obtain more than $16 million in loans from banks and mortgage companies.

The companies allege that Hayley Kissel — whom they describe as a "sophisticated individual" with degrees from the University of Oregon and Willamette University — kept quiet about her husband's actions so she could continue to live in luxury.

"Hayley Kissel ... provided assistance to him in his fraudulent activities," the lawsuit asserts. "She aided and abetted Andrew Kissel in perpetrating those activities in order to maintain her lavish lifestyle."

The trial, in front of a six-person jury, started Thursday in County Court in Bend and is expected to take a few weeks. Attorneys for the companies are expected to explore her role in two of Andrew Kissel's fraudulent schemes — bilking a Redmond City apartment co-op of more than $3 million and illegally transferring the couple's Washington home so that Andrew could use it as collateral to get more than $5 million in bank loans.

Hayley Kissel, 45, is expected to testify, and there's a chance that a relative of Carlos Trujillo, the man charged with orchestrating Andrew Kissel's slaying, could be called to testify.

"It's certainly risky to go after the widow of a man who was murdered," Bend attorney Patrick Gil said.

Gil is the executor of Andrew Kissel's estate and is monitoring the trial, even though the estate has no assets remaining and is not a party to the lawsuit.

Madras attorney David W. Rubin, who is representing Hayley Kissel, has asked Gil for permission to introduce Andrew Kissel's psychiatric history at the trial. Neither Rubin nor attorneys representing the two title companies could be reached for comment on the case.

Just days before he was expected to plead guilty to fraud-related charges — and face up to 10 years in a federal prison — Kissel was found dead in the couple's former Bend home. He had been tied up and stabbed several times in the back.

Bend police arrested Carlos Trujillo, the family chauffeur, and his cousin, Leonard Trujillo, in March of this year in connection with the slaying. Leonard Trujillo of La Pine, Oregon., has been charged with capital felony, and Carlos Trujillo, who police believe was the last person to see Kissel alive, has been charged with conspiracy to commit murder.

Police allege that Carlos hired Leonard to kill Andrew Kissel, although they have not revealed a motive. Both men have pleaded not guilty and are being held, awaiting separate trials.

Debtors have been picking at what's left of Andrew Kissel's estate since his death, filing claims in state and federal courts in at least two states.

Kissel, 46 when he died, owed more than $20 million to several banks that gave him mortgages based on documents he had falsified. Kissel would take out a mortgage on a property, then file forged documents indicating that the mortgage had been paid back, even though it hadn't, authorities had said. He would then use that credit to get additional loans on the same properties from different banks.

None of the creditors have been more aggressive than Fidelity National and Chicago Title, the two companies that insured many of the bad mortgages that Andrew Kissel eventually defaulted on.

Having exhausted all efforts to get money from Andrew Kissel's estate, they are now going after Hayley Kissel's personal assets. Hayley Kissel is a Wall Street investment analyst whose father, Derish Wolff, is chairman of a Idaho engineering firm. He purchased the Bend house, where Hayley and her two children now live, for $1.9 million.

The two title companies are expected to try to convince the jury that Hayley Kissel knew far more about her husband's nefarious dealings than she has let on. They allege that if she had alerted authorities, Andrew Kissel wouldn't have been able to obtain as many mortgages as he did because banks would have caught on to his scheme earlier.

The lawsuit says she knew what her husband was up to as long ago as early 2003, when Andrew Kissel admitted to her that he had stolen more than $3 million from the Redmond co-op.

Part of the lawsuit surrounds the transactions involving the Sun River, Oregon, home the Kissels purchased in 1998 for $425,000.

Around the time that the co-op scandal was uncovered, Andrew Kissel transferred the Oregon property into just his wife's name. The lawsuit says Hayley Kissel knew this was done to shield it from creditors.

About a year later, Andrew Kissel fraudulently transferred the Oregon property back to his own name by forging documents. Shortly after that transfer he obtained a $2.6 million loan, using the Oregon property as collateral, from Washington Mutual Bank.

The lawsuit alleges that Hayley Kissel became aware of this forgery but did not tell anyone about it.

By keeping silent, the lawsuit alleges, she allowed her husband to later obtain two other loans.

hbm said...

The DEM's in Bend are so fucking few, that they might as well be considered extinct

Check party registration numbers lately?

Actually back when this was a mill town there were a lot more Democrats. Lefty union members. Even some old Wobblies.

hbm said...

Stocks skidded lower on Tuesday afternoon despite reassurances from the chairman of the Federal Reserve, Ben S. Bernanke, that the central bank was prepared to lower interest rates, words that many investors had said they were waiting to hear.

“You are getting all the things that you would think the equity markets would respond very favorably to,” Steve Sachs, director of trading at Rydex Investments, said. “But at this point it just doesn’t seem to be doing it. It’s the attitude of sell regardless of what the news is.”

The Dow Jones industrial average, which had fallen about 140 points before Mr. Bernanke’s remarks, dipped to a 300-point deficit before climbing back. But shortly before the close, the blue-chip index was down more than 430 points, with shares of banks and real estate firms shouldering the biggest losses.

The broader Standard & Poor’s 500-stock index was off by more than 4.8 percent even after Mr. Bernanke strongly hinted that the Fed would lower interest rates this month in the face of a worsening outlook for the economy and financial markets. -- NY Times


Even good news is being interpreted by the market as bad news. The long and short of it: We. Are. Fucked.

Quimby said...

>> Think Eugene, this ain't Eugene this is BEND, PUG-TOWN.

True, but its about to become JUG TOWN!

Anonymous said...

Even good news is being interpreted by the market as bad news. The long and short of it: We. Are. Fucked.

*

We are getting closer to the bottom.

We need more chickenshit, hbm "the sky is falling" and "We. Are. Fucked." reactions from the common folks.

Maybe a few cliff divers committing suicide (oh, wait, we already have a few of those...) and more people selling on good news, bad news, and any news.

Here is my pearl of wisdom. "Once the selling stops, we will have hit bottom."

We NEED MASSIVE FEAR and CAPITULATION to get us there.

Keep posting, you hbm douchebag.

Quimby said...

So, does the old "invest and forget" still hold true stock market sages? (ie. Butter, Lava et al)?

I've never bought that theory that says 8% avg return on the market so invest and forget.

Anonymous said...

I moved my investments out of the market about two months ago. People accused me of being short sighted. A friend of mine was saying "Just keep it in there, it always goes back up, don't even look at it". That really gave me the chills. Just like dot com stocks, real estate, "it always goes back up" mantra really rang false. I put half of the money into an extra principle payment on my house here in Bend. Glad I did so.

Quimby said...

Me too but I sold it all 6 months ago....man am I a chicken! LOL!

Marge said...

People dropping like flies!!
First the stock market all I can say is ouch many times over..

Next...yet another potential, maybe, rumored contractor suicied. Nobody is talking..all lips tied shut. Even friends and coworkers not talking, a definite GAG order has been slapped on it..Gary Norman of Norman Building and Design. No obits found either.It's been floating around for 11 days or so. Anybody hear anything. Marge is out of touch at an internet cafe in the SE.

Quimby said...

Dang, the same Gary Norman in the Bulletin with the booming Barnwood business? Always has to be a bright side, right BULL?

If this is true, maybe having an article published about you in the bulletin is akin to waking up with a horse head in your bed.

Anonymous said...

Bush and Cheney should have been impeached long ago. It still would have great symbolic value even in this late hour.

Anonymous said...

Palin's Attack On Obama's Patriotism Legitimizes Questions About The Palins' Association With Group Founded By America-Hating Secessionist
By Greg Sargent

Sarah Palin attacked Obama's patriotism today over his association with former Weatherman Bill Ayers -- a move that makes it perfectly legitimate to raise questions about the Palins' associations with a group founded by an Alaska secessionist who once professed his "hatred for the American government" and cursed our "damn flag."

In Colorado today, Palin seized on the big front-page New York Times story about Ayers and Obama, which concludes that the two men "do not appear to have been close," to launch her most vicious attack yet on the Illinois Senator -- a harbinger of what's to come.

"This is not a man who sees America as you and I do -- as the greatest force for good in the world," Palin said. "This is someone who sees America as imperfect enough to pal around with terrorists who targeted their own country."

If Palin is going to say this, it is now perfectly legitimate to point out that she repeatedly courted a secessionist group founded by someone who openly professed hatred of the American government, cursed our flag, and wanted to secede from the Union. Sarah's husband, Todd Palin, was a member of this group, which continues to venerate that founder to this day, for years.

As you already know, the group is the Alaska Independence Party, which sees as its ultimate goal seceding from the union. Todd was a member, with a brief exception, from 1995 until 2002, according to the Division of Elections in Alaska.

And though Sarah Palin herself was apparently not a member of this group, there's no doubt that she repeatedly courted this secessionist organization over the years. In 1994, Palin attended the group's annual convention, according to witnesses who spoke to ABC News' Jake Tapper. The McCain campaign has confirmed she visited the group's 2000 convention, and she addressed its convention this year, as an incumbent governor whose oath of office includes upholding the Constitution of the United States.

The founder of the AIP was a man named Joe Vogler. Here's what he had to say in a 1991 interview, only a few years before Palin attended its convention: "The fires of hell are frozen glaciers compared to my hatred for the American government."

He also said this: "And I won't be buried under their damn flag. I'll be buried in Dawson. And when Alaska is an independent nation they can bring my bones home."

Vogler has also said: "I'm an Alaskan, not an American. I've got no use for America or her damned institutions."

McCain apologists will argue that Sarah Palin was not a member of this group. But Obama wasn't a member of any Ayers anti-American group, either. And again, Palin repeatedly courted the AIP, and her husband was a member for years.

The main takeaway from today's Times story is that Obama's ties to Ayers are, if anything, less substantial than commonly alleged. So if the Ayers association means Obama "palled around" with "terrorists," as Palin put it today, surely Palin can be said to have "palled around" with a secessionist party whose founder openly professed hatred of America.

If Palin is going to directly question Obama's patriotism over his association Ayers, surely all these facts are now fair game and freshly relevant.

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

The long and short of it: We. Are. Fucked.

Welp, at least we can agree on that.

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

Bank America lost 20% today, ...

The strong are starting to look weak.


I never understood why BofA was considered "strong". They are HYPER-EXPOSED to credit cards. I considered them like Wachovia on steroids.

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

In the Redmond Spokesman:

Dale Steven “Steve” Dorn
May 26, 1955 - Sept. 28, 2008
Steve Dorn died Sunday, September 28, 2008. Steve was born May 26, 1955 in Salem, Oregon to Dale Dorn and Kathleen Angland Dorn. Steve was a second generation native Oregonian who attended Salem area schools, graduating from Sprague High School in 1973. Steve loved Central Oregon and spent most of his adult life in the Redmond area. Steve raised two beautiful children of whom he was extremely proud. Jacob recently moved to the Seattle area and Katie is a Redmond high school scholar.
Steve was a Central Oregon businessman. He owned and operated the Redmond branch of Dorn Brothers Auto and Truck Sales for over 20 years. This business was founded originally in 1947 by his father and uncles and is continued by two of his brothers. Steve coined the phrase “Dorn Good Deals” which is well known all over the state of Oregon. Steve most recently owned and operated Steve Dorn RV & Marine.
Steve had a tremendous sense of humor that he used in business as well as his personal life. He had numerous friends, many who dated back to his school days in Salem. Steve’s friends, both old and new, were a great source of comfort and support to him. His passions were first and foremost his kids. He loved the outdoors, boating, hiking and skiing. Steve and his kids traveled throughout the West and had many memorable adventures.
Steve is survived by his children, Jacob and Katie, his father, Dale and his sister and brothers, Sue (Jeff) Ford, Dan (Laura), Mike (Kim) and John (Debbi) Dorn. He is also survived by his niece and nephews, Riley, Kory, Cooper and Carter Dorn. Steve was preceded in death by his nephew, McKenzie and his mother, Kathleen.
The family wishes to thank all who have been a part of Steve’s life. A celebration of life was held Saturday, October 4, 2008 at 11:00 am at the Redmond Community Church. Donations may be made to the Salvation Army or the charity of your choice in Steve’s name.

Anonymous said...

this is the big question is bruce pussy a native oregonian or a piece of shit cali? better yet bruce have you ever lived in cali? answer the question please.

Anonymous said...

well, I can think of other questions MUCH bigger than asking if brucepussy ever lived in cali...but whatever...

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

If you're supposed to buy Fear and sell Greed, this is about the best time to buy in 20 years...

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

this is about the best time to buy in 20 years...

And that's really stocks only.

The real economy is going to be in recession for quite awhile...

And Bend home prices will be in the dumps for decades.

Anonymous said...

did you know that in Montana we hit Orygunoonies in the nose, Cali's are the worst, but not really much difference. ...west coast is west coast.....

Anonymous said...

I am simply astounded at the above posting knowledge of geography. Amazing...'night all.

Anonymous said...

ever been to Montana and told a native you were from Oregon?

Anonymous said...

Did McCain shoot himself tonight? what is up with the proposal to "buy up the bad home loan mortgages in America and renegotiate at the new values of those homes"? Is it not the governments job to protect contracts? What happened to being a conservative? sealed my no vote,

Mike said...

I lived at Flathead lake in Montana and the natives were all too drunk to even know where Oregon is, but I told them I was from Bend. I could see that you would possibly be dodging swings if you said you were from Eugene.

Mike said...

What happened to Steve Dorn ? I had a boat repair business that started next to the canal where Freddies is now and one day in the fall of 1989 I was working on Steve's Liberator and I was telling him that the boat repair business was wide open and he took of with it two years later. It is people like him that will keep things alive in CO.

Mike said...

I am trying to see what the economy will be in Bend with no RE or a mill ? You have the mountain from Dec thru April. Trout fishing opens and brings in a few bucks then some motel and high lakes business, but really what the hell will sustain any kind of year round population ? Will it actually go back to 12,000 or less. How many Home Depots or Lowes have ever had to close ? I know Les Schwab will be there because they know how to take care of their own people. Have any of you people that write on this blog ever read his book. BTW, you are only fucked if you think you are and if you stand on the side of the mountain and wait for the roast duck to fly in, you have a very long wait. Steve Dorn was a go-getter and I guess that answers my own question and that it will be the small business people like him that will be able to survive in CO.

Quimby said...

Yeah, I've read it. Hell of a man.

He actually told Sizemore that he wouldn't donate much money to his cause because he thought that America was already too far gone. Boy, was Les right.q

Anonymous said...

Steve Dorn just hung himself at work a few days ago mike, he had tons of real estate investments in McCall-Idaho ( std sub-subdivisions ), and Redmond commercial that had gone south.

Anonymous said...

Wash-Post (LIB) has a great article here about how bad the fucking debate last night sucked. I concur, OR-BOMB-EO said the 'exact' same shit as the last debate. They should have just pre-recorded this shit a year ago, and keep playing it over&over.
***

A Showdown That Was More of a Letdown

By Tom Shales

Wednesday, October 8, 2008
Considering how adamantly John McCain advocated a "town hall" arrangement for this year's presidential debates, viewers might justifiably have expected him to thrive in the debate held last night in Nashville, since it followed that format. But there was little if any thriving in the hall.
This Story

*
Economic Crisis Dominates Debate
*
ANALYSIS: For the New Contagion, the Same Old Prescriptions
*
A Showdown That Was More of a Letdown
*
Open Season on Small Game
*
Interactive: Debate Decoder
*
Obama, McCain Trade Jabs on Economy
*
Transcript: Analysis: Second Presidential Debate
*
Obama, McCain Square Off in Town Hall
*
The Fix: Nashville Skyline Debate: First Thoughts
*
McCain, Obama Differ Dramatically on Health Care
*
Fact Checker: Truth Squading the Candidates

View All Items in This Story
View Only Top Items in This Story

Neither McCain nor his Democratic opponent, Barack Obama, gave a particularly electrifying performance and neither seemed truly responsive to the current frightening headlines about the potential collapse of the U.S. economy. How could they be responsive and truly topical when both stuck to repeating campaign catchphrases and promises that dated back to the earliest stages of the political season?

One thing became a bit clearer: "They don't like each other," as commentator and Democratic strategist James Carville succinctly put it on CNN.

In their previous encounter, McCain appeared to take pains not to look his opponent in the eye, or look at him, period -- acting as if Obama didn't exist.

During the debate, McCain made another of his seemingly demeaning, nasty references to Obama. Describing legislation that had been backed by President Bush, McCain rhetorically asked, "Guess who voted for it?" and then answered his own question: "That one," he said, gesturing toward Obama. On CBS, commentator Jeff Greenfield thought "that one" would be "the major headline sound bite" of the debate, which goes to show, in part, how insubstantial the debate was.

But the snarled "that one" also contributed to McCain's image as a kind of mean old Scrooge, not so much a battle-scarred warrior as an embittered one. "Intemperate" is an adjective often applied to him, and again McCain demonstrated why. He also was perhaps the more relentlessly repetitious of the two men -- though Obama trotted out many a rerun from past appearances -- and was guilty of addressing the audience with his old standby phrase "my friends" at least 15 times in the 90-minute session.

Both candidates were untethered and free to move away from their perches in the Belmont University auditorium where the debate was held. McCain seemed to prowl around the room and Obama strode around it, as if silently murmuring "king of the castle" to himself. Neither candidate demonstrated a "fire in the belly" passion, though both had moving autobiographical moments.

It was incumbent on McCain to come up with something new, perhaps, since Obama is leading in many polls and thus arguably was wise to stick with his usual game plan. At times McCain was grandiose to an almost laughable extent, as when vowing like Sheriff John to hunt down Osama bin Laden (with his bare hands?): "I'll get him. I know how to get him, and I'll get him no matter what."

Moments after calling Ronald Reagan his great hero, McCain shifted gears and said, "My hero is a guy named Teddy Roosevelt."

The biggest wet blanket on the debate stage, however, was moderator Tom Brokaw, who also played a kind of military role: Commander of the Clock. Time and again, the NBC newsman inflicted frivolous rules on the candidates that only served to frustrate true debate and the kind of give-and-take that a "town hall" format supposedly encourages. At least twice, Obama started to answer one of Brokaw's questions only to have Brokaw call instead on McCain, which was rude and embarrassing.

Exactly what the rules were remained unclear, even though Brokaw explained them at the start of the debate. He called for "discussion" periods that seemed only a minute long; what kind of a "discussion" is that? If a discussion really did threaten to break out, Brokaw got grumpy and called it off. The least important thing on an occasion such as this are a bunch of arbitrary rules concocted by the debate organizers (with the counsel of both parties, Brokaw insisted).

Brokaw looked old. McCain looked old. Obama looked young.

Members of the studio audience gathered in the hall were chosen from among voters in the area who still identify themselves as "undecided," Brokaw said. How many intelligent, informed Americans still cop to that label? Maybe there is something commendable in waiting the maximum amount of time to make up one's mind about the better of the two candidates, but the audience members were hardly inspired when it came to fashioning questions for them.

Were the relatively minor matters that many of them brought up among the reasons they'd remained undecided? If so, they'd better wake up and smell the coffee -- if they can still afford coffee, that is. The debate had the aura of an almost meaningless ritual being conducted in a soundproof room while outside, panic and calamity were spreading like giant cracks in the earth.

The candidates seemed protected from reality rather than having met on the field of battle to confront it.

Anonymous said...

. Have any of you people that write on this blog ever read his book.

*

Yes, we have read his book, and talked about SCHWAB for a million years PUG KUNT.

SCHWAB is a the fucking WELFARE NAZI QUEEN of BEND.

GO to bendbubble.blogspot.com and read about all the SHIT right-wing NAZI schwab has blessed on Bend.

Anonymous said...

What happened to Steve Dorn ?

*

Mike we have ONE FUCKING RULE HERE for NEWBIE PUG's.

READ THE FUCKING COMMENTS & BLOGS.

A few weeks ago Steve Dorn was torn apart when he offed himself, its YOUR fucking job to read, you lazy fucking PUG.

Anonymous said...

Next...yet another potential, maybe, rumored contractor suicied. Nobody is talking..all lips tied shut. Even friends and coworkers not talking, a definite GAG order has been slapped on it..Gary Norman of Norman Building and Design.
*

I guess its time that we put all our COLLECTIVE ASS on this one.

Gary Norman.

Any rumor of HOW? We have had our developers of BEND jumping off cliffs, guns, hanging, ... Builder Folk got to start doing original suicides in this town.

Note that ALL these self immolate-rs are PUG's? PURE BEND.

Anonymous said...

JEEBUS XMAS this KUNT(PUG) was one of those guys building mcMANSIONS @ SMITH ROCKS, even in hell they'll NOT except his corpse.

#
Central Oregon Custom Homes - Gary Norman Homes - Gary Norman Homes
At Gary Norman Homes — known throughout Central Oregon for unparalleled service ... Gary Norman Homes, Inc. 15 S.W. Colorado Suite 200 Bend, Oregon 97702 ...
www.garynormanhomes.com/ - 9k - Cached - Similar pages
#

Anonymous said...

HBM I said BEND has always been PUG town, even in Rancher/Mill day.

Wobbly's weren't the new BAMBIST liberals. Wobbly timbermen were real tough men that just wanted a fair share.

Modern Pug's are ass sitters in front of O'reilly & Limbaugh, modern lib's don't exist in Bend.

Bend TODAY is southern-cali, .e.g. PUG country, Orange-County shopper pug's. The worst kind of larvae.

Anonymous said...

MARGE-The time-line is right, this guys building went from 20 to zero, so then he takes his 'nest egg' and buys 'old barns' and fucks them, and flips the material on EBAY, of course the BULL was the KISS of death. Another EBAY trader dream-wet, buys the 'barn'.

***

Giving new life to old barn wood
Bend builder hit on a popular idea and created a company to pursue it

By Andrew Moore / The Bulletin
Published: September 30. 2008 4:00AM PST

What: Barnwood Inc.
Where: 15 S.W. Colorado Ave., Suite 200, Bend
Employees: 6
Phone: 541-385-7700
Web site: www.barnwoodincorporated.com

Bend resident Gary Norman has lived in the High Desert for 30 years and has built homes here for just as long. Six years ago he started his own construction company, Gary Norman Homes Inc., and has since built approximately 20 high-end custom homes, ranging in price from $1 million to $3 million.

Due to feedback he received from a house featured on the 2007 Central Oregon Tour of Homes, Norman decided last year to form a separate company to pursue full-time an innovation he showed off in the award-winning home. Throughout the home, from exterior siding to interior cabinets and trim, Norman used reclaimed wood from old barns.

Barnwood Inc. was born from that effort. Barnwood is run out of the same west-Bend office as Norman’s home-building business.

Through leads developed by his staff and other agents, Norman travels around the region to find the old barns, stables, fences and other outbuildings from the Pacific Northwest that have the right amount of weathering and luster. If a building’s wood meets Norman’s qualifications, he buys the structure and then dispatches a crew to disassemble it.

The rescued material is then run through a metal detector to find and remove old nails and bullets. The wood is then turned over to craftsmen Norman employs who use the wood to build everything from doors to dining sets. For interior applications, the wood is often finished with a water-based stain that gives the wood a rich, warm tone.

“There’s nothing that can replicate the look and feel of what we offer,” Norman said. “It’s forgiving in some aspects but also unforgiving, as it can be real brittle, but it’s magnificent.”

In nearly a year, Norman has amassed nearly 300,000 board feet of barn wood from the Northwest. Norman also sells the wood to developers.

Although his homebuilding business has softened, Norman said he is still building and has several projects under way or planned. At the same time, he’s working to build up his Barnwood business.

Q: How’s business for Barnwood?

A: It’s good.

Q: Are there enough barns in the country to keep the business model running?

A: It’s barns and outbuildings, but yes. I’m sourcing a lot from Montana, the Ronan Valley. We got a whole bunch there that will last us two to three years.

Also the Hamilton Valley in Montana, buildings near Boise (and) Central Oregon has quite a few old buildings.

Q: Do you worry about being taken to task by preservationists for taking down old structures?

A: Most of the barns we tear down are absolutely dangerous — they are going to fall down. We don’t tear down historic buildings. We come in and take them down at the request of ranchers and farmers because they are hazardous.

Q: What are the challenges to your business?

A: I took the leap … we’ve made a decision now to sell our wood instead of coveting it, and would sell to a developer, but now we are a full-blown company and it’s (like) any new business that has pitfalls. We’re getting sales, but everything’s challenging. It’s nothing that’s not combated every day.

Q: How has the economic downturn affected Barnwood?

A: It’s such a new business, it’s difficult for me to say because I don’t have anything to base it off of, but I have to say I think with Barnwood my timing is right with the whole baby boom generation retiring. They are going to build houses — the housing industry has always been cyclical and this is a doozy of one — but the impetus of Barnwood is to remain green and deliver product that they can’t match with anything else … it’s a look-good and feel-good business. I see nothing but a bright horizon.

Q: Do many of the custom homes built by Gary Norman Inc. use barn wood?

A: I use it in some custom homes, but some customers don’t like that rustic look, so I don’t want to pigeonhole myself, but this type of product really lends itself to developments such as Brasada Ranch and Pronghorn (resorts).

Q: Where do you see Barnwood in five years?

A: I envision in five years … we’ll have 1 million board feet on the ground … and we’ll be selling to the whole Pacific Northwest (instead of only Oregon now).

Anonymous said...

Q: Do you worry about being taken to task by preservationists for taking down old structures?

A: Most of the barns we tear down are absolutely dangerous — they are going to fall down. We don’t tear down historic buildings. We come in and take them down at the request of ranchers and farmers because they are hazardous.

*

I love here the FUCKING KUNT PUG is using the at PUG word 'MOST', most of course is PUG-CODE for none at all, ... "yeh we only go after the shit that has long gone down into the the mud and is sitting horizontal. We don't bother with free standing structures?. "If it ain't rotten, and worm ridden, then we ain't want that barn-wood, nobody wants to preserve this shit".

"Next month we intend to visit old Injun grave sites, and remove corpses, there is a tremendous biz on EBAY for this un-wanted, and unclaimed material".

Anonymous said...

Deja-vu, ... RE collapse, and cannibals robbing OLD structures, ... for materials, ...

In the last BEND RE dump of 1980, the investors lost their fucking ass.

Realtors formed pools, vast sums of money were lost, and 'contracts' ( hits ) were put out on those who ran-off with the money.

Much of the money ended up in South-East Oregon, down near Fields, and & Denio. Prior to late 1980's there were still dozens of 'intact ghost towns' the ranchers had never fucked with them, but the these 'investors' of Bend had built 'investments' in places like Diamond, and they hauled off the ghost towns just like NORMAN is doing above. The BULL talks like this is NEW SHIT, no its not, today almost ALL of Oregon's ghost towns are GONE, cuz of this shit.

Now of course our NORMAN had to go to Montana, Idaho, to steal old shit, and reduce our heritage to some fucking print-rack for a 'retired Bend Banker, post bubble'.

The BULL probably did this story on Norman in August 2008, the story ran Sep 30, 2008, according to Marge, NORMAN had already offed himself 11 days prior to Oct 5, 2008, thus he never got to see his name in the BULL.

Fact, when the BULL does a story about you CREATING FALLING KNIFE BIZ, during BEND-DEPRESSION-N, your going down, and into the ground.

Anonymous said...

Mike,

Your are a retarded PUG, but we'll tell you once, so you know the rules here.

1.) Read the fucking past blogs, and comments.

2.) We don't do stupid.

The BP ( Bruce-Pussy ), might be a naive fucking Bambist, but he's not stupid, nobody here is stupid. It's fairly clear that you are stupid, a first step is to get off your lazy ass and read old posts and comments. Then quit being stupid.

Anonymous said...

Q: Where do you see Barnwood in five years?

A: I envision in five years … we’ll have we'll have destroyed all Oregon structures over 5+ years old, that every structure remaining in Oregon, will be a synthetic Hollern STD crap shack.

Q: But what of the barn-wood, certainly someone will use it?

A: Yes, our customer is the bankers of wall street. Once the bailout $700B trickles down to them, they'll all retire in Bend, they seem particularly fond of 'Barn-Wood Toilet Seats". We have have a series of "Barn-Wood Outhouses" that will soon be out so ex-Bankers can stroll their property in the AM, and read the WSJ in their own Barn-Wood Outhouse.

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

Wow, I thought CACB was on the road to recovery... it was near $12 2 wks ago... now in the $6's again.

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

Economy falling apart, 401K's in the crapper, business & personal BKs all around...

But in Bend? Let's check today's Bulletin Business headlines:

Achieve the perfect fit with a personal tailor

Jewelers can keep your rings, budget sparkling

Cowboy up with custom boots

Bath-time bliss

Oregon-made spa products offer everything but the rubber duckie

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

And YES, those are ALL from The Business Section of today's Bulletin.

Kool Aid up, cowboys.

hbm said...

Steve Dorn was a go-getter and I guess that answers my own question and that it will be the small business people like him that will be able to survive in CO.

I think you could have picked a better example -- Dorn reportedly committed suicide. The "go-getters" are the people who tend to take big risks and either win big or lose big. Some of them have the mental and emotional toughness to handle the losing, others don't.

I am trying to see what the economy will be in Bend with no RE or a mill ?

Recreation, second homes, retirees, and the goods and services that such people require. Not much there to build an economy on. I don't see the population going down to 12,000 but it could well drop under 60,000 or even 50,000. I wouldn't complain -- that actually would make this town much more liveable.

Re the debate: Andrew Sullivan said Obama "mauled" McCain. I agree. McCain is finished. Visit some of the right-wing blogs and they're already talking up Sarah Sockpuppet for 2012. But my guess is she'll be taken down by scandals and stupidity before then.

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

Andrew Sullivan said Obama "mauled" McCain. I agree. McCain is finished.

Yeah... it was painful. I think it's pretty much over.

hbm said...

Central banks around the world cut short-term interest rates by up to half a percent on Wednesday after investors across Asia and Europe unleashed waves of sell orders onto already depressed stock exchanges.

The Federal Reserve, the European Central Bank and other central banks from Britain and Switzerland to Canada and China announced rate reductions within seconds of one another. The British government separately announced a plan to pump billions of pounds into the country’s leading banks as part of a plan that would result in considerably greater government influence over the financial sector there.

The Fed said in a statement that, because of weakening economic activity, it had cut the Federal funds target rate by half a percentage point, to 1.5 percent. It also cut its discount rate by the same amount. The vote was unanimous. -- NY Times


Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought the problem was that nobody is lending money, not that rates are too high. Borrowers don't need encouragement to borrow; lenders need encouragement to lend. And if rates go lower, wouldn't that tend to DISCOURAGE lenders from lending?

Somebody help me out here.

Quimby said...

>> Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought the problem was that nobody is lending money, not that rates are too high. Borrowers don't need encouragement to borrow; lenders need encouragement to lend. And if rates go lower, wouldn't that tend to DISCOURAGE lenders from lending?

>> Somebody help me out here.


Me thinks that people need to stop borrowing and save their goddamned money...pay off their debts (including their houses) and get back to being a positive savings rate nation.

Hurrumph!

(PS-We should have local Granges too with square dancing and home made apple pies and ... banjos ......)

Anonymous said...

OPB (91.3) is airing the show on the Bend economy taped on monday right now - Wednesday 9am-10am.

Anonymous said...

>> Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought the problem was that nobody is lending money,

*

OK, folks lets stop the fucking BULLSHIT.

Here's the FACT, if you got good credit you can get money all day long, I can get ALL I want from USBANK right now at 3.9%.

You want a car, you got perfect credit & income? No problem, ... now here is the problem.

80% of USA public and corporations have SHIT credit NOW. Thus they can't get money, well they can for 28%, ...

So that is the FUCKING issue.

The real way to frame this fucking question is ...

HOW can an idiot, who doesn't have a job, and who has fucked credit ( less than 750 ), get money?????

He/She Can't END of FUCKING STORY.

Anonymous said...

OPB (91.3) is airing the show on the Bend economy taped on monday right now - Wednesday 9am-10am.

*

Yep, they're going to tell us how to save BEND post tourism & housing??

How about going back to mid 1980's and before???

The FUCKING ISSUE here is that NOBODY can put humpty-dumpty back together again, ME & HOMER have killed this dead horse, BEND is a desert-ISL, its inhabitants are all CARGO-CULT, and the CARGO isn't coming anymore.

Anonymous said...

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought the problem was that nobody is lending money, not that rates are too high. Borrowers don't need encouragement to borrow; lenders need encouragement to lend. And if rates go lower, wouldn't that tend to DISCOURAGE lenders from lending?

Somebody help me out here.

*

HBM your doing the fucking DUMB-FUCKING DUNCAN game of begging the question, don't be a fucking idiot.

FIRST of all you DUMB FUCKING CUNT, the FED can only touch the over-night discount rate, which is what banks loan, the lower the rate, the MORE PROFIT for banks.

This doesn't have a fucking thing to do with the PUBLIC. This has to do with the rate that banks can borrow money, wrt to the rate they can loan, they'll not lower the rate to the public, what your seeing is a desperate attempt to increase bank profit so they can stay in business.

hbm said...

Me thinks that people need to stop borrowing and save their goddamned money...pay off their debts (including their houses) and get back to being a positive savings rate nation.

That's good advice for individuals, but how does it apply to businesses? If a guy wants to grow his business or start a new business and can't get a loan, how is he supposed to do it? Save his pennies for 20 years?

Credit is the lifeblood of any capitalist economy; stop the flow of credit and the economy dies. This is not anything new -- it has been true for hundreds of years.

Anonymous said...

Yeah... it was painful. I think it's pretty much over.

*

It was 'painful' because both were the fucking mcSAME, they were all over agreeing with each other on everything,

NUCLEAR ENERGY? GOOD

Is the economy going to get worse? We don't know, ...

Both blamed each other for supporting BUSH???

OR-BOMB-EO was pathetic, like the wash-post story above which is a lib-dem publication said, OR-BOMB-EO is still running the campaign rhetoric like its 2006, cuz that is what works.

I hope when this fucking OREO gets the fucking office he can start telling the fucking truth, we must have somebody that can tell the truth. At least fucking mcCAIN dwelled hard on corruption at wall-st, you didn't see any anti-establishment from OREO.

MOST pathetic was the rhetoric was the exact same as the last debate from both, its been 2-4 weeks, and its like they have both been asleep.

Marge said...

According to County permits he has 4 active building permits. I didn't find Bend City info though.

There is no rumor of how he offed himself. Big puzzle right now. Put your ears on and find someone that will talk.HBM out on your tin reporter cap.

Anonymous said...

Credit is the lifeblood of any capitalist economy; stop the flow of credit and the economy dies.

*

JEEBUS xmas HBM, when the fuck have you ever owned a fucking biz?

I have started 1/2 dozen high-tech startup's and RAN a big zero with debt, always self financing,

This BULLSHIT that you have to borrow at the bank to make payroll is fucking BULLSHIT, yes people on that model, yes they're going to commit suicide.

People who survive, and you'll see me & DUNC write a lot about 'survival' during the bad times, run a biz by cash-flow, and if you don't have the cash-flow, you don't spend the fucking money.

Yes, during bad times, by definition those with NO CASH, have a bad credit report, and they can't get money.

BY definition you can ONLY get money when you don't need it, that's why USBANK will give me all I want, cuz I have the match in the bank, ... most of these fucking businessmen that are killing themselves have been running their business 'nigger rich' for years, and when the economy dives like NOW, they're OUT, this is how it is.

This is why its always essential to have six months cash on hand whether your an individual or a biz, that way you got 3-6 months to change spending and adjut, if you don't have the cash your OUT, you don't survive.

Anonymous said...

There is no rumor of how he offed himself. Big puzzle right now. Put your ears on and find someone that will talk.HBM out on your tin reporter cap.


*

Marge did you read all the BULLSHIT above about his 'barn-wood', this kind NORMAN was a real fucking grave robber.

HBM has NEVER shared rumors with us marge, its cuz he's public, only US anonymous assholes can share rumor.

Anonymous said...

Credit is the lifeblood of any capitalist economy; stop the flow of credit and the economy dies. This is not anything new -- it has been true for hundreds of years.

*

Not true HBM credit is the lifeblood of a 'mercantile economy', nothing to do with capitalism.

Perhaps the rail-road took stock up front to finance, BIG projects, ... but SMALL biz always paid as they went, ONLY the big boyz use 'other people's money' (OPM) to play.

Like most things when little people try to act BIG, they go down.

Yes, HBM and all you cunt's here, your first 20 years you got to save a lot of money, and that is the kind of world we're returning to.

Anonymous said...

According to County permits he has 4 active building permits. I didn't find Bend City info though.

*

If you read the above NORMAN had built 20 real fancy homes, but in the recent years his biz had gone to shit.

Then he got involved in this 'barn-wood' grim-reaper thing, my personal guess is that he was murdered.

He had taken all his bubble-year marbles and 'doubled his bet' on barn-wood.

Material is material these days, nobody wants it. Another stupid fucking business praised by the BULL, and then they die, more of the same in BEND.

Anonymous said...

NORMAN was harvesting for barn-wood in MONTANA most recently, I would check the morgue records for his death there, most likely some old timers took a disliking to this modern carpet-baggger from Bend, California.

Quimby said...

>> If a guy wants to grow his business or start a new business and can't get a loan, how is he supposed to do it? Save his pennies for 20 years?

Quimby just a backward coot but I've never had to borrow a cent for my businesses because I know how to save $$$ and live below my means. "Cash is king" I once heard and it stuck. If I have to borrow money to do it, then it ain't getting done. I try to never back myself into a corner. Don't others think this way?????

hbm said...

Not true HBM credit is the lifeblood of a 'mercantile economy', nothing to do with capitalism.

Can you give me any historical example of a capitalist economy that operated without credit? Even in Roman times and the Middle Ages there were money lenders.

hbm said...

quimby, your way may work for a business that's very small and content to stay that way, but being able to grow a business requires being able to seize opportunities when they present themselves, and that requires ready cash, which business owners often do not have sitting in a bank or under the mattress. Of course taking on more debt than you can reasonably afford based on your (rationally projected) cash flow is always bad business, but there is nothing innately wrong with a business borrowing money. And to think that the American economy is going to start operating on a cash-only, pay-as-you-go basis is just a fantasy.

hbm said...

JEEBUS xmas HBM, when the fuck have you ever owned a fucking biz?

As managing editor of The Bulletin I oversaw a news department with about 30 employees and a budget of nearly a million dollars. After leaving The Bull I operated my own public relations business for over 10 years and never lost money on it. Never took any loans for it either. But it was a very small business and I had no desire to take on the burden of running a big one.

Quimby said...

>> quimby, your way may work for a business that's very small and content to stay that way,

Granted. I may be different than many other cash intensive businesses. That's why I'll never be a billionaire I guess, I hate debt.

>> And to think that the American economy is going to start operating on a cash-only, pay-as-you-go basis is just a fantasy.

Sorta like the 1930s? Maybe coming sooner than you think I fear.

bruce said...

Re: better yet bruce have you ever lived in cali?

Nope. Madison, WI, Eau Claire, WI, Alta, UT, SLC, UT, Bend, OR (with one winter in Ketchum, ID between high school and college)

hbm said...

"A recession is when the money goes back to its rightful owners." -- Plutocrat Proverb

Even Great Depression II could have a silver lining. If things get really bad we could see price deflation. People holding cash will do okay; so will people with stable (even if modest) incomes, whether from a business, investments or pension.

Everybody else is fucked.

hbm said...

Sorta like the 1930s? Maybe coming sooner than you think I fear.

The barter economy could be big again. It was in the '30s.

Anonymous said...

>I can get ALL I want from USBANK right now at 3.9%.

And I can fuck my wife all I want right now. But you can't, and neither can the rest of Bend.

Same with lending. Big fucking deal if you can get money. Most people can't, and that was his point.

Fuckhead.

bruce said...

RE: Steve Dorn was a go-getter and I guess that answers my own question and that it will be the small business people like him that will be able to survive in CO.

Funniest thing I've read here lately.

Re: At least fucking mcCAIN dwelled hard on corruption at wall-st, you didn't see any anti-establishment from OREO.

Yep, his campaign manager, who lobbied for Fannie and Freddie, told him all about it. And Palin learned even more about it at her fundraiser Monday:

'While campaigning today, Sarah Palin was the featured guest at a $10,000 per person fundraiser in Naples, Florida.

The fundraiser was held at the home of John "Jack" Donahue - the Chairman and founder of Federated Investors.

In November 2005, Federated Investors paid $72 million in fines and penalties in a SEC investigation of "unethical trading practices." Federated was caught up in the huge Canary Capital mutual fund/ hedge fund scandal that Spitzer and the SEC investigated.'


Same ol', same ol'...

Anonymous said...

Obama rejects McCain's mortgage buyup plan
By CHARLES BABINGTON – 59 minutes ago
INDIANAPOLIS (AP) — Democrat Barack Obama's campaign criticized John McCain's mortgage bailout plan Wednesday, saying it would cause the government to lose money by paying too much for bad loans.
McCain's proposal to spend $300 billion in federal funds to buy distressed mortgages was a highlight of Tuesday's presidential debate, and it seemed to catch Obama off guard. At first, Obama's campaign said he had made similar proposals and there was nothing new in McCain's remarks.
But after McCain aides offered more details Wednesday, Obama's campaign shifted gears.
The plan would cause the government "to massively overpay for mortgages in a plan that would guarantee taxpayers lose money, and put them at risk of losing even more if home values don't recover," Obama economic adviser Jason Furman said in a statement. "The biggest beneficiaries of this plan will be the same financial institutions that got us into this mess, some of whom even committed fraud."
The statement did not detail why the plan would fail. Some mortgage officials, however, say the great majority of bad loans are owned by large pools of investors who would sell them only at prices much higher than their current worth.
If McCain's plan would have the government pay all or most of the difference between a home loan's original value and its renegotiated lower value, as these officials understood it to do, it could prove costly.
McCain's proposal would devote nearly half the $700 billion from the recent financial rescue package to buying troubled mortgages directly, rather than indirectly aiding the nation's financial markets.
Speaking to several thousand people in Indianapolis on Wednesday, Obama criticized McCain's health care and economic positions, but did not mention the new mortgage proposal.
Obama urged Americans not to panic over the faltering economy, saying "there are better days ahead" — especially if he is elected president. He acknowledged public anxiety over the financial crisis in starker terms than usual.
"We meet at a moment of great uncertainty for America," he said. "But this isn't a time for fear or panic. This is a time for resolve and leadership. I know that we can steer ourselves out of this crisis."
Obama ridiculed McCain for recently saying "the fundamentals of our economy are strong." But in his 35-minute speech on a muddy harness-racing track, he made a similar argument.
"America still has the most talented, most productive workers of any country on Earth," Obama said. "We're still the home to innovation and technology, colleges and universities that are the envy of the world. Some of the biggest ideas in history have come from our small businesses and our research facilities."
Obama repeated his claims that McCain's proposals would cause many Americans to lose their employer-provided health insurance because the Republican would tax those benefits. He said the $5,000 tax credit that McCain would give people would not be enough for them to buy private insurance, a claim that McCain disputes.
"The American people can't take four more years of John McCain's George Bush policies," Obama said to loud cheers.
Obama praised the Federal Reserve and other leading central banks for cutting interest rates Wednesday. "I support that action," he said. "This is a global problem and it needs to be solved through a global effort."
He again vowed that only those making more than $250,000 a year would see higher taxes under his administration, and 95 percent of Americans would receive tax cuts. He promised to spend $15 billion a year "in renewable sources of energy to create 5 million new, green jobs over the next decade."
Obama read his speech from a TelePrompTer, his habit in recent weeks. He strayed from the prepared text, however, to mention GOP vice presidential nominee Sarah Palin, the Alaska governor who has led her ticket's attacks on Obama.
McCain "and Gov. Palin are out there saying all kinds of stuff," Obama said.
Indiana is normally a solidly Republican state at the presidential level, but polls here suggest a close race.

Anonymous said...

Quimby says: "Me thinks that people should save their goddamned money ... We should have local Granges too with square dancing and home made apple pies and ... banjos"

OK, Quimby, you're such a sourpuss. How bout we head downtown for drinks at the Loft, then dinner at Volo, and possibly -- if you're into it -- late night dancing at the Blacksmith.

bruce said...

This is really rich, from an interview with conservative columnist David Brooks decrying the dumbing down of the Republican party and the intelligence of Barack Obama:

David Brooks: Sarah Palin "Represents A Fatal Cancer To The Republican Party"
David Brooks spoke frankly about the presidential and vice presidential candidates Monday afternoon, calling Sarah Palin a "fatal cancer to the Republican party" but describing John McCain and Barack Obama as "the two best candidates we've had in a long time."

In an interview with The Atlantic's Jeffrey Goldberg at New York's Le Cirque restaurant to unveil that magazine's redesign, Brooks decried Palin's anti-intellectualism and compared her to President Bush in that regard:

[Sarah Palin] represents a fatal cancer to the Republican party. When I first started in journalism, I worked at the National Review for Bill Buckley. And Buckley famously said he'd rather be ruled by the first 2,000 names in the Boston phone book than by the Harvard faculty. But he didn't think those were the only two options. He thought it was important to have people on the conservative side who celebrated ideas, who celebrated learning. And his whole life was based on that, and that was also true for a lot of the other conservatives in the Reagan era. Reagan had an immense faith in the power of ideas. But there has been a counter, more populist tradition, which is not only to scorn liberal ideas but to scorn ideas entirely. And I'm afraid that Sarah Palin has those prejudices. I think President Bush has those prejudices.

Brooks praised Palin's natural political talent, but said she is "absolutely not" ready to be president or vice president. He explained, "The more I follow politicians, the more I think experience matters, the ability to have a template of things in your mind that you can refer to on the spot, because believe me, once in office there's no time to think or make decisions."

The New York Times columnist also said that the "great virtue" of Palin's counterpart, Democratic vice presidential nominee Joe Biden, is that he is anything but a "yes man."

"[Biden] can't not say what he thinks," Brooks remarked. "There's no internal monitor, and for Barack Obama, that's tremendously important to have a vice president who will be that way. Our current president doesn't have anybody like that."

Brooks also spent time praising Obama's intellect and skills in social perception, telling two stories of his interactions with Obama that left him "dazzled":

Obama has the great intellect. I was interviewing Obama a couple years ago, and I'm getting nowhere with the interview, it's late in the night, he's on the phone, walking off the Senate floor, he's cranky. Out of the blue I say, 'Ever read a guy named Reinhold Niebuhr?' And he says, 'Yeah.' So i say, 'What did Niebuhr mean to you?' For the next 20 minutes, he gave me a perfect description of Reinhold Niebuhr's thought, which is a very subtle thought process based on the idea that you have to use power while it corrupts you. And I was dazzled, I felt the tingle up my knee as Chris Matthews would say.


And the other thing that does separate Obama from just a pure intellectual: he has tremendous powers of social perception. And this is why he's a politician, not an academic. A couple of years ago, I was writing columns attacking the Republican congress for spending too much money. And I throw in a few sentences attacking the Democrats to make myself feel better. And one morning I get an email from Obama saying, 'David, if you wanna attack us, fine, but you're only throwing in those sentences to make yourself feel better.' And it was a perfect description of what was going through my mind. And everybody who knows Obama all have these stories to tell about his capacity for social perception.

Brooks predicted an Obama victory by nine points, and said that although he found Obama to be "a very mediocre senator," he was is surrounded by what Brooks called "by far the most impressive people in the Democratic party."

"He's phenomenally good at surrounding himself with a team," Brooks said. "I disagree with them on most issues, but I am given a lot of comfort by the fact that the people he's chosen are exactly the people I think most of us would want to choose if we were in his shoes. So again, I have doubts about him just because he was such a mediocre senator, but his capacity to pick staff is impressive."

Quimby said...

>> late night dancing at the Blacksmith

Does this "Blacksmith" place have some of them pretty dancing ladies in bloomers? Ohhhhh, I loves me some pretty ladies doing high kicks in those bloomers...and that fine piano playing too. You buying?

hbm said...

How Low Can It Go? Dow closes at 9258.10.

Despite the current calamity I really don't believe we will have a repeat of the Great Depression. Another Great Depression is unlikely because of the safety net programs put in place after the first Great Depression -- programs, I would remind you, that right-wingers would like nothing better than to abolish.

Grover Norquist has said he regards the administration of William McKinley as the high-water mark of America. I'll never forget that right after the "Republican Revolution" of 1994, when the Repubs took over Congress with their "Contract on America," George Will wrote a column saying the conservative agenda should be "the repeal of the 20th Century."

These people don't just want to go back to the days before Franklin Roosevelt -- they want to go back to the days before TEDDY Roosevelt, i.e. before the progressive movement. They want a return to the Golden Age of the robber barons, the age of no labor unions, no consumer protections, no environmental protections, no workplace health and safety regulations, no minimum wage, no 40-hour week, no Social Security, no Medicare, no social safety net of any kind. They might not all be as candid about it as Norquist and Will, but that's their true agenda.

The current economic meltdown might be a blessing in disguise because it seems likely to stop them from carrying out that agenda.

Anonymous said...

Quimby: You buying?

You betcha!

(turns to Buster)

Psst -- could you get me one of your 3.9% loans at USBANK? In return, I'll get you a toilet seat that's made out of barn wood!

Quimby said...

Good to see you back Dunc ;)

Mike said...

OK Anonymous, you are right as far as me being a FUCKING KUNT idiot on Steve Dorn and now I think that he is a total FUCKING JACKASS COWARD for displaying himself in the garage for his family to see. These suicidal losers should just go out to the desert and become coyote scraps. Who started the larger scale greed in CO ? Was it Arnie Swarens, Jan Ward, Jake Wolfe.

Anonymous said...

Can you give me any historical example of a capitalist economy that operated without credit? Even in Roman times and the Middle Ages there were money lenders.

*

Jeebus HBM, you must be trying to make me pass a a fucking shit-stone.

OK, I'll explain capitalism versus, banking, versus 'mercantilism'.

Capitalism, let's not even discuss that I think we all know what it means.

The bank is just a guy that hold's other people's excess CASH, a safe place for those that don't need it, ... well until modern banking where they issue 10-100X for every dollar in deposit, long ago I told ALL here to read a 'primer on money'. If you want to understand USA banking read the "Primer on Money".

NOW mercantilism, got real big in the USA POST 1920'S, WHERE MARKETing folk got everybody to BUY more than they needed, and better yet they bought stuff with money they don't have. In every society since the time of ROME, mercantile societys collapse, because at some point confidence is lost by the lender. Mercantilists so fucking hard up to sell their SHIT, off credit to everyone. They always want to sell more shit, they run out of buyers, so they offer credit so everyone can buy excess product, eventually the waste causes total unemployment.

This is what happened to RE in BEND, it became a commodity for everyone, ...

So now we're stuck, in a OUR modern world, like old, sure government can print money, ROME did that over 500 years and went from GOLD coin, to lead, to paper, to ZILCH, utter collapse. When the Roman coin became worth zero, farmers quit bringing grain to Rome. When there was no longer food to eat, Rome was finished.

How long can the USA get other country's to accept their dilluted paper money who knows?

The problem with mercantilism is people buy all this shit they don't need, and they think its their god given right to get the shit before they work. Bush said after 911 "GO SHOPPING", yes that is always the solution. Mercantilists largely control our government, they own our politicians, ...

Capitalism is not the reason for our distress, free capital, is just a means that ALL men can do what they want.

When the government gets in the job of offering credit to anyone with a breath, to buy pet-rocks, you know that the game is up. The lender quits lending cuz he knows the pet-rock buyer has nothing to lose.

There has to be a balance, between credit for those who need a tractor for the farm, but credit should not be given for people to go out dancing and dining in Bend, OR.

Like our recent HELOC Bend the vehicle was the HELOC, and everyone went wild in Bend, there was a spending ORGY for 6+ years, all these new biz in Bend got into the action, now with the HELOC gone, there is no money. All the 'mercantilists' ( those that sell worthless SHIT, which is all of downtown Bend ) are fucked,...

I'm fond of the old downtown Bend, with hardware stores, shit you can use.

So now today you have these HUGE fucking corporations, that all depend on easy credit for people to Buy their SHIT. When a credit crunch happens like now its bad because everyone works for people who depend on the game, well now its game over.

This is not a new cyclic event, all 'mercantile' societys go through boom-to-bust. It is inevitable when 'Other Peoples Money' is treating with no respect. The few of US with money pull back, and all you parasites who lack planning and discipline starve.

Anonymous said...

Can you give me any historical example of a capitalist economy that operated without credit? Even in Roman times and the Middle Ages there were money lenders.
*
That's not what I said HBM, what I said is that CAPITALISM is not the fucking cause, the cause is 'mercantilism'.

What the fuck do you want our GOVERNMENT to become socialist, and tell us all what to do with our time & money????????

Right now we have a choice, I didn't BUY shit, I didn't do HELOC's, and I save lots of money. I own all my property's. I didn't play the fucking "BUY NOW, PAY LATER" GAME. THOSE THAT DID ARE FUCKED.

That Game is called 'mercantilism', and it sounds like YOU HBM didn't play it either, you seem to suggest you live within your means, and understand that being rich is NOT wanting SHIT.

Anonymous said...

Quimby said...

Good to see you back Dunc ;)

*

Yeh, I sort of suspected our latest MORON was 'dunc' by his use of the begging of the question, and acting dumb, like its some kind of fucking socratic method that he is on to, that nobody knows about.

It must be a mental deficit that goes along with having a liberal arts degree, this need to be subtle.

bruce said...

Buster, you are starting to sound Islamic. You know, the Koran's prohibition on paying interest.

Paying interest, preferably something like 28% on credit cards, is the end game of mercantilism.

We're there. The road forward is covered in dense fog. Time to go slow. Real slow.

Anonymous said...

American economy is going to start operating on a cash-only, pay-as-you-go basis is just a fantasy.

*

I'll tell you all one thing, and I don't know if you notice, I have lots of heavy equipment & trucks, and buy a lot of tools and parts.

Every where I have gone now for weeks is a sign "NO CHECKS" no problem, I use different cards for each project-line for accounting, quit carrying checks years ago.

I find this current trend of "NO CHECKS" to be very interesting, the point is there is no way to verify a check.

Thus we're there now today, if you ain't got cash, or a credit-card that say's your GOLD, your fucked.

Welcome to the USA.

Anonymous said...

Blogger bruce said...

Buster, you are starting to sound Islamic. You know, the Koran's prohibition on paying interest.

*

My TWO favorite religions are MUSLIM & MORMONISM, they both believe a man should get all the pussy he can afford.

I'm not against interest, I just don't like to pay it myself. I don't loan money, but I rent houses. Thus in a way I act as a bank, I always tell my renters, ... its easy to make a $400k home worthless, a landlord is just like a bank if they destroy the home, your out $400k, or have to file an insurance claim.

I have written about this TOO MUCH BP, but I'll repeat myself, since the dawn of time, 97% of all societys are MORONS, they let the 'mercantilists' sell them shit they don't need, and they pay 28% interest on the money they borrow, these people never get ahead, and live like dogs their entire life. This is all from "richest man in babylon", nothing new here folks.

Anonymous said...

Yeh, I sort of suspected our latest MORON was 'dunc' by his use of the begging of the question, and acting dumb, like its some kind of fucking socratic method that he is on to, that nobody knows about.



Or maybe it's someone who just keeps popping in every now and then for the last year to call Buster a fuckhead. Which I can agree with.

Quimby said...

Have you seen the latest news in Sisters?

PAC ups the ante in council campaign

From my vantage point, the builders in the Sisters area like them "NO SDCs" they got going over there in Bend. Time to stuff the ballot box for the council seats and vote us in some PORK. "More housing is what will solve our problems."

Anonymous said...

You'd think Sisters would be fed up with all the empty houses and "for sale" retail they already have.

Anonymous said...

There is a scanner available to any individual at most banks for around $200-300 that is called "remote capture" and you scan the check thru it and it instantly posts the funds to your account. The biggest advantage to it is that the issuer can't do a chargeback like they can with a credit card.
I sell marine engines and drive systems worldwide from Lake Powell and bank wire, Post office money orders and remote capture from a check has no risk of funds being reversed.

Anonymous said...

All this will be very painful but necessary for cleansing of corruption especially for local corruption. Lookout hoa's the power is going to go down the toilet and the people will regain their voice. And the majority will prevail.The leaders might be wise at this point to listen to the majority because your days are numbered.

Anonymous said...

There is ONLY one KUNT in this group that cares about Sisters, and that Kunt is BUTTER/HOMER.

Anonymous said...

Anybody that has to 'borrow' money to keep his biz around should have SHOT that biz in the head years ago.

The fact that 'dunc' has to take out credit card debt is fair enough evidence that his biz is not self-sustaining.

He bought the biz in late 1986 post the last BEND RE recession. He has NEVER seen bad times, bad times would be 1982->1986.

Any business that needs debt to live, is not going to survive this 'correction'.

Unless the owner has 'deep pockets', and is running a 'hobby business'.

Anonymous said...

The biggest advantage to it is that the issuer can't do a chargeback like they can with a credit card.

*

Yeh, got to stop those charge-backs, so that we can rip off the customer, and get away with it,...

On the subject of checks, I once had cashed a check, and had the person 'stop' the check a month after deposit, and they got there money back. If you think that check's are cash, then you belong in this group ( your a moron ).

Anonymous said...

AIG Gets Billions More To Borrow
Forbes - 45 minutes ago
What, more? American International Group has blown through the $85.0 billion it borrowed from the United States government last month and is getting an additional $37.8 billion line of credit from the Federal Reserve as it seeks to shrink itself into ...

Anonymous said...

Paris Hilton urges Sarah Palin to ‘show some skin’

MSNBC - 2 hours ago
Paris Hilton has some fashion advice for vice presidential hopeful Sarah Palin: show some skin.

Anonymous said...

yeh, NO SDC in Sister's means they can be a slut-sister to their big-brother city Bend.

What makes Bend #1 is no SDC cost, HOLLERN is #1 everybody wants to be a HOLLERN, every town in Central Oregon will permanently waive SDC cost.

Build and they will CUM.

There are ten's of thousands of cali's in Orange County & LA, living in their cars'. If we build ten or twenty thousand homes in Sisters, then we can fill them with Calis!!! This is our future.

mike said...

With a check scanner it is the same as cash. After it is scanned & the funds are posted to your account you hand the check back to the issuer. Go to Wal-Mart and pay with a check and you will see how it works. If the money is not in their account it rejects it and there is no such thing as a bounced check. If someone sends you a check in the mail and it fails to scan then you do not send them the goods. People issue chargebacks often after they have returned home a thousand miles away from here using their credit cards to rent waverunners, jetskis, boats, harleys, etc. What I am saying is for anyone in a small biz to stay up on the cash is to never have open accounts for suppliers and that all material is paid for after the customer has funds paid in full posted to your account, before the shit is even ordered. Then the labor is worked out on a weekly basis. People do not like it but who needs to be taken care of first. I seldom see these principals applied as most people starting out in a small business think that they need a "small business loan" and computers, and a bitch to count the beans, instead of paying cash for tools, equipment , etc. as they go along. You may not like Les and whatever fiascos his family did after he was out of control of the business but the way he started out and grew are the basics to have cashflow instead of staying up all night wondering how the payments will be met. It's too bad more people do not read this blog as they would get a better financial education by what you people (Not me being a mere moron) write than they will at any college. I have nothing against college, but the one thing they do not teach is how to make money, they only teach how to get a J.O.B. 90% of the population at the turn of the century owned their own business.

Anonymous said...

Palin/Bush for 2012!!! Pugs Declared retarded and fit for USA leadership. Palin blamed for McCain failure? A Hollow OREO made good by Pug denial.

Sarah Palin's incompetence stuns media's conservatives

By Yael T. Abouhalkah, Kansas City Star Editorial Page columnist

Even more prominent conservatives in the media are saying out loud what many Americans think: Sarah Palin is not qualified to become vice president of the United States.

This backlash doesn't come from the liberal mainstream media that have been hounding Palin since she was announced as John McCain's running mate.

Instead, it's respected voices from the conservative side of the media aisle -- like columnists George Will and Kathleen Parker, who went so far as to suggest that Palin step down from the ticket for the good of the GOP.

The latest well-known conservative Palin basher is David Brooks, one of the very few remotely conservative voices on The New York Times opinion pages.

In a Monday speech, Brooks said Palin "represents a fatal cancer to the Republican Party."

"Do I think she’s ready to be president or vice president? No, she’s not even close to that."

Specifically, Brooks has written that Palin "has not been engaged in national issues, does not have a repertoire of historic patterns and, like President Bush, she seems to compensate for her lack of experience with brashness and excessive decisiveness."

Well said by Mr. Brooks.

Palin, of course, will brush this off as another attack from the mainstream media, even though it comes from what should be a friendly crowd of conservatives.

Anonymous said...

credit cards to rent waverunners, jetskis, boats, harleys, etc.

*

Mike your a fucking consumer asshole of the worst fucking kind.

It's exactly these kind of people that we don't need. Much less renting Harleys, owning Harleys, or riding Harleys, or filing a chargeback on their Harley rental.

You sound like a fucking clone of DORN, why don't you do the hang-man's exit and save us your cali-shit.


This WHOLE FUCKING recreation in BEND, and rent or consume, is the fucking problem, everybody has been marketed that BEND is the nations toilet to play.

Then you go off on a tangent cuz MORONS like yourself have an out to file a chargeback after they're long gone from BEND, and realize they got FUCKED.

Every tourist that goes to BEND gets fucked, this is a long known.
Bend fucks you, and sells you a condo time-share with an HOA, and Mayor Friedman gets a cut.

Welcome to BEND, just say no to Harley people ( PUGS ). { Nothing against 1%'ers, I'm talking fat-ass posers. }

Anonymous said...

Last month dunc was a crying liberal to the left of HBM, today he is 'mike' his latest concoction of comic imagination. The Pug right-wing tourist of Bend.

Anonymous said...

I have nothing against college, but the one thing they do not teach is how to make money, they only teach how to get a J.O.B. 90% of the population at the turn of the century owned their own business.

*

Yes, and prior to the 'turn of the century' the 'mercantilists' hadn't taken over, pre 20th century, 90% of USA were farmers.

Then came industrial revolution, and folks came to city's FORD paid $5/day to build auto's by automation. Folks were given credit in order to purchase the goods they made, and this has been going on for 100 years, and now its all crashing and burning because our money is now worthless.

College can NOT teach how to make money, as professors by definition are liberal-arts welfare recipients, by defn 99% of prof's have NEVER had their own biz, you can't teach what you don't know.

Running a biz with DEBT is not a good idea MIKE, cuz when the cycles like now come your OUT. The main principal of biz is 'survival', and if you have to BORROW to make payroll, then something then your not running a biz, your a fucking idiot borrowing to feed your make believe family.

Les Schwab, we have all read his books, we have written 100's of articles over the last 2-3 years on the bastard, go fucking read them, we don't deal on old issues here.

The goal is to debate BEND economy, and the future.

Schwab is dead, and BORGMAN the new CEO is the #1 WELFARE QUEEN of BEND.

Schwab tire is going to be sold to a major, and the PRINEVILLE was FUCKED by BORGMAN long ago. Recently SCHWAB stole $15M of BEND CITY TAXPAYER money to build a new CAMPUSSY in BEND. WORST KIND OF FUCKING WELFARE, is SCHWAB welfare.

OLD FUCKING KUNT SCHWAB knew what kind of man BORGMAN WAS, old man schwab was a fucking NAZI.

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

Bend home sales up in September

By Jeff McDonald
Published: October 09. 2008 4:00AM PST
- Andy Zeigert / The Bulletin
Andy Zeigert / The Bulletin

Bend’s housing market showed a positive sign in September when the number of single-family home sales rose to the highest level in more than a year, according to a report released Wednesday by the Bratton Appraisal Group.

In September, 120 homes sold in Bend, up from 97 in August, according to the report, which tracks real estate data for single-family homes on less than an acre and excludes condominiums, townhomes, duplexes and mobile homes.

The jump was significant, according to Andy Zook, an owner of Bend-based Arbor Mortgage Group.

“Price points continue to fall,” Zook said. “First-time homebuyers are smelling the opportunities. Buyers are being drawn back into the marketplace.”

Seventy-six of the 120 homes sold last month in Bend, or 63 percent, were priced below $300,000, according to the report.

Median sales price per square foot, which is the most reliable indicator of how much people are paying for homes, dropped from $157 in August to $139 in September in Bend, the city’s lowest level since April 2005. The city’s median sales price, meanwhile, dropped slightly to $276,000 in September, down from $283,000 in August.

A year ago, the median price — which measures the point at which half the homes sold are priced higher and half lower — was $332,000 in Bend in September 2007.

The nation’s economic crisis has dampened enthusiasm in the real estate community, according to at least one broker who has seen buyer interest waning over the past few weeks.

“There was a sense that we were getting close to the bottom,” said Leighsa Francis, a broker for Re/Max Equity Group in Bend. “But all of a sudden (with the economic crisis), fears resurfaced. Now, I don’t think we are close to the (local housing market) bottom. Two months ago, I thought we were.”

Jade Meyer, chief financial officer for Brooks Resources Corp., which has development projects throughout Central Oregon, expressed cautious optimism about September’s sales uptick.

“What’s killing us (in Bend) is that inventory” of homes on the market, he said.

It would take 15 months to clear the existing inventory of homes from the Bend market if sales were to continue at the current pace and no new homes were listed, according to the report. Typically, about six months is considered a healthy level of inventory, real estate officials have said.

Other communities in Central Oregon also showed signs of improved sales, high inventories and falling prices in September and the third quarter of 2008, according to the report.

In Redmond, home sales rose from 32 in August to 40 in September as square footage prices fell to $117, their lowest level since July 2005, according to the report. The median price in Redmond in September was $204,000, down from $224,000 in August and $244,000 in September 2007.

High inventory continues to plague other communities, including Sisters, which has recorded 83 sales in the past 12 months and has 135 homes listed for sale, according to the report. The city recorded 19 sales in the third quarter.

Bratton measures all communities outside Bend and Redmond on a quarterly basis only.

Sunriver had 17 sales in the third quarter, and has seen 81 homes sold in the last 12 months. Currently, 167 homes are listed for sale.

In La Pine, 62 homes are listed, more than double the 30 homes that have sold in the last 12 months. The city recorded six home sales in the third quarter.

Jefferson and Crook counties, reported 23 and 44 home sales in the third quarter, respectively. The counties sold 84 and 126 homes in the last 12 months and have 116 and 242 homes listed for sale, according to the report.

Central Oregon’s improving home sales in September mirrored a national housing report released Wednesday by the National Association of Realtors, which showed pending home sales jumped 7.4 percent in August.

Pending home sales activity surged as buyers took advantage of lower home prices and affordable interest rates, according to the association’s Web site.

Prospective homebuyers can get a 30-year fixed mortgage for less than 6 percent, Arbor Mortgage’s Zook said.

“There’s a lot of mortgage money available,” he said. “For the reasonably qualified homebuyer, there are numerous options at very reasonable rates.”

Homebuyers can put as little as 3 percent down and buy a house with a loan from the Federal Housing Administration, Zook said.

Central Oregon residents outside of Bend are eligible for 100 percent financing from the U.S. Department of Agriculture’s rural housing program, he said.

Or they can get a conventional loan if they are “reasonably qualified,” he said. That means having income that can be documented, a down payment and a good credit score, he said.

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...

Nice job Costa! The last 1/3rd of that article is a blatant attempt to induce people to BUY HOMES.

Zero Down! Reasonably Qualified! Lots of Money Available! Come'n Get It!

IHateToBurstYourBubble said...


Jade Meyer, chief financial officer for Brooks Resources Corp., which has development projects throughout Central Oregon, expressed cautious optimism about September’s sales uptick.

“What’s killing us (in Bend) is that inventory” of homes on the market, he said.


Hollern will most likely FIRE THIS PERSON for using the word KILLING in conjunction with real estate.

Of course, she is closer to the truth than anyone quoted in the Bulletin EVER. It IS KILLING US.

Anonymous said...

KILLING 'US', who is this 'US' WHITE MAN HOMEE(BUTTER)???

Are you talking for DORN, NORMAN, McDONALD, SWISHER?????

What about the NO-SDC cost? Isn't BROOKS that lobbied for zero-cost development just recently? SO that they could continue the glut and commoditization of home in central-oregon?

BROOKS has been a DEAD-MAN walking for 2-3 years, are they 'too big to fail??"

Why should HOGG-HOLLERN King Nazi o BEND fire this bitch? She tell's the truth. You think this will stop HOLLERN from shooting, or hanging himself? BROOKS is the largest employer in the REGION, 100's of LLC's, and its all down 80% YTD. I'm talking gross income, OH YEA the KUNTS here say to borrow, borrow from WHOM? ALL THIS waste of HUMANITY known as BROOKS-RESOURCE now must layoff at least 3,000 people in the region. 'Killing', yes it must be KILLING HOLLERN to feed this bitch with his own pocket change.

Anonymous said...

Wall St Urinal declares conservative MOVEMENT intellectually bankrupt & dead. Long Live HOLLERN.

***

The GOP Peddles Economic Snake Oil
Suddenly Republicans are against market values?
By THOMAS FRANK

OK, let me get this straight: The central axiom of conservative Republicanism is that government is inherently corrupt and can't do anything right.

Over many years of ascendancy, conservative Republicans have filled government agencies with conservative Republicans and proceeded to enact the conservative Republican policy wish list -- tax cuts, deregulation, privatization, outsourcing federal work, and so on.
[The Tilting Yard] AP

And as a consequence of these policies our conservative Republican government has bungled most of the big tasks that have fallen to it. The rescue and recovery of the Gulf Coast was a disaster. The reconstruction of Iraq was a disaster. The regulatory agencies became so dumb they didn't even see the disasters they were set up to prevent. And each disaster was attributable to the conservative philosophy of government.

Yet now we are supposed to vote for more conservative Republicans because we learned from the last bunch of conservative Republicans that government just doesn't work.

That is the advice of Sarah Palin, Republican vice-presidential nominee, in last week's debate with her Democratic counterpart, discussing the dread prospect of universal health care: "Unless you're pleased with the way the federal government has been running anything lately, I don't think that it's going to be real pleasing for Americans to consider health care being taken over by the feds."

Conservative misrule, prompted by conservative disdain for government, proves that government cannot be trusted -- and that the only answer is to elect another round of government-denouncing conservatives.

"Cynicism" seems too small a word for this circular kind of political fraud. One reaches instead for images of grosser malevolence. It's like suggesting that the best way to recover from pneumonia is to stand in the rain for three hours. It's like arguing that the way to solve nuclear proliferation is by handing out weapons-grade plutonium to everyone who asks for it.

Consider also the perverse incentives that such a logic would establish. If we validate Mrs. Palin's thoughts on federal bungling by electing her to the high office she seeks, we are encouraging her to bungle everything that comes her way. After all, by her thinking, such bungling will not discredit her doctrines but rather confirm them, demonstrate the need for more Sarah Palins down the road. We will be asking for it, and it's not much of a stretch to predict that we will get it.

In the three-ring circus of conservative blame-evasion, however, that's only one act. Over in the House of Representatives, a new breed of Republican idealists spent last week dazzling the faithful by taking a bold stand against the Wall Street bailout. The administration's plan was a "slippery slope to socialism," declared their leader, Jeb Hensarling of Texas.

One might have admired their pluck but for the breathtaking opportunism of their own counterproposal, the "Free Market Protection Act," which is described on the Web site of the Republican Study Committee. True, it is not a "slippery slope." It is a headlong stampede over a precipice, a running leap out a skyscraper window.

It starts by calling for "voluntary private capital" to solve the problem of bad mortgage-backed securities (MBS). Several sentences later it asks for a "mandatory" fee to be levied on all MBS, good or bad, and apparently without regard for whether it's held here or overseas, where American law doesn't apply. I asked William Black, the University of Missouri-Kansas City professor of economics and law whom I quoted last week, what he thought of this scheme. He replied, "This is significantly insane as a matter of finance -- and unconstitutional as a matter of law. This clause would cause a world-wide financial panic were it implemented."

Back at the study committee's Web site, I see conservatives call to "Suspend 'Mark to Market' Accounting." Suddenly our "free-market protection" gang has decided it's unfair to make companies value their MBSs at . . . the market price. Somehow the all-seeing market has gone irrational, and so companies must be allowed "to mark these assets to their true economic value," meaning, one might say, to mark them however they please, a practice that, to put it shortly, is what got us into this mess in the first place.

Space prevents me from discussing the plan's provisions to temporarily suspend capital gains taxes and repeal the Humphrey-Hawkins Full Employment Act. But I will note that, in discussing the derring-do of Mr. Hensarling and his hard-core colleagues, the New York Times chose to refer to them as "populists" -- friends of the common people. As an indicator of the confused state of our political discourse, the signals don't flash any brighter than this.

Years ago, conservatives realized that to destroy the legitimacy of your adversary's concepts is to destroy your adversary. Today we are surrounded by the wreckage. Much depends on our success in rebuilding.

Anonymous said...

ICELAND has floundered today. They now need to form a new bank, and new currency.

Just like the US will soon do with the federal reserve.

A new currency, and congress get to control the money, not seen since 1917. It's almost here. How much current money will convert to the new 'dollars'???

This is why its so essential to not have your money in the USA, my bet is ten to one will be the exchange on the new currency post federal-reserve.

This is why Bernanke/Greenspan/Paulson are doing what they do to save their system, but its a system that will fail.

We'll go back to the gold standard, in order to get confidence of the world, and to once again to except our currency.

You can expect bank-holidays very soon, and you can expect gold to be collected once again very soon.

This is ALL playing out exactly like 1930's. HBM technology doesn't mean a fucking thing, it just means that FEWER people control the levers of power, like we say in the biz of tech, 'garbage in, garbage out',

This is NOT about housing, this is about insolvency of the currency, this is about SIV's, derivatives, credit-swap-defaults, all being worth penny's on the dollar, this is about 90% or more of the ALL WORLD banks to be insolvent, to the tune of 100's of TRILLIONS of dollars. Housing 'bubble' is just the straw that broke the camel's back.

Anonymous said...

“What’s killing us (in Bend) is that inventory” of homes on the market, he said.

*

I have long predicted the city will purchase vast STD's tract's and burn them to the ground to reduce inventory. To save HOLLERN. It's just an NON-HOLLERN inventory problem, if we didn't have all these monkeys doing what HOLLERN does, we wouldn't have an inventory problem. If only HOLLERN was allowed to build in the region, then all would be good.

Save HOLLERN 2010. Ban building permits to anyone but Brooks.

Anonymous said...

Market is again falling like a rock.

Anyone want to bet when we'll be at 7500??

bruce said...

Best description of the credit default swap ever (as Marge noted earlier this week) here, on This American Life:
http://thisamericanlife.org/Radio_Episode.aspx?episode=365

Free MP3 download: http://podcast.thisamericanlife.org/podcast/365.mp3

Get it while you can, before next weeks show.

bruce said...

Good financial blog: http://www.becker-posner-blog.com

hbm said...

90% of the population at the turn of the century owned their own business.

90% of Americans in 1900 owned their own business? Sounds bogus to me. Got anything to back it up?

hbm said...

College can NOT teach how to make money

No. That's why there are law schools and medical schools.

But seriously: Why should colleges be teaching people how to make money? Is that the be-all and end-all of existence?

Making money is something anybody with a reasonable amount of intelligence and the will to use it can do. It doesn't need to be taught in colleges. Historically, it wasn't. It was a skill you picked up elsewhere.

The problem with people like Buster is they think that if somebody knows how to make money he knows all there is to know. Or at least all that's worth knowing. It's a pretty common attitude in America and explains why so many of us virtually worship top businessmen -- although recently history amply demonstrates they're just as big fools as anybody else.

Anonymous said...

Best description of the credit default swap ever (as Marge noted earlier this week)
*

BP I have been writing about this forever, no reason to make it complicated, cuz its not, they're just insurance policy's that are traded as assets, trouble is there are no reserves as in 'cash', that the reserves are now just more insurance policy's ( Credit Swap Defaults ) on top of the same. A MTN as big as MT-B of paper with no real assets. All traded in lieu of cash for years. Like their big brother derivatives.

US Corporations too have been allowed to issue their own paper ( like cash ), which today has no value, and yesterday got bail'd out by treasury.

Since the 1970's everyone has been horse-trading paper issued by MORON's in lieu of cash-equiv, with a nod and shake of head, moodys and the best credit-reporting that money can buy all slapped 'AAA' on this 'paper'.

Today of course, we 'mark to market' so we can determine what we really own, and its not pretty some 90% of all US assets on the books, are backed by worthless paper asset's. Credit-Swap-Defaults, is simply the #2 game in town. While Derivatives are #1, RE-MTG is like #4 in sheer size of play.

Everyone has KNOWN for years, that pay's attention to the charade. Today its well known that the Pug's are the emperors with no clothes, of course the Dem's are McSAME.

The PUSSY likes to think this shit is new, or nobody understand's it, ... for protection of the investor, all fund's were insured, trouble is that insurance company's ( THINK BUFFETS BERKSHIRE ) became the biggest players of all, they took premiums and reserves and doubled, and ten-folded the bets, to a 1,000 to one odd's, well they rolled the dice since the 1960's, and now they rolled wrong, and the table gets cleared.

Credit-Swap-Defaults are just insurance, think AIG, & BERKSHIRE. They made a fortune on selling this insurance, but when it was time for AIG to pay claims, they went BK, and had to be bailed-out. BUFFET too to date has been bailed-out, the problem is this is too big, nobody has enough money to pay out on all the loss claims. Thus there will be NO CONFIDENCE for years to come in the 'system'.

Everyone went along with the charade for 40 years, cuz all were making money, from 1967 to 2007. Now everyone is losing money, and the finger pointing begins.

No different than tulip-mania, or south-sea-bubble, entire civilizations get caught up in fraud. Then eventually the 'assets' are marked-to-market, and everyone gets wiped out, this is an old story of human history.

Anonymous said...

But seriously: Why should colleges be teaching people how to make money? Is that the be-all and end-all of existence?

*

Buster didn't say this shit about college HBM, buster has several graduate degree's, buster is no anti-ed, PUG.

I remember when I started going to college back in the 50's, my grand-mother thought I was an idiot. She said that ONLY doc's and lawyers needed to go to college....

Buster never said that money is all been all, do all. Had you been around here for 2-3 years you would know that Buster frequently quotes JP-GETTY, who said "I would give up all my money, for the love of one fellow human being", Getty was surrounded by parasites, and when he wrote that in "How to Get Rich", in the 1960's, he was the richest oil-man in the world. No money, is like sex, highly over-rated.

Twain said that defecation is far better than intercourse.

'Mike' said that college isn't useful, Mike is obviously from the PALIN brood. Enough said about 'mike' who I think is dunc, as dunc likes to create new persona's weekly, its part of his comic world.

I'm not really sure what college is for. In the old days rich kids got private tutoring from people like Newton. Then 200->300 years ago institutional education began to educate like a factory. Even in Greece education was done by tutoring one-on-one, albeit Plato & Socrates got blow-jobs by the students ( I also have a philosophy degree ).

Money is freedom, in our penal colony we call AmeriKKA, that is what BUSTER say's about money. Enough Said.

Two hundred years ago, the greatest math minds of world history, were all taught one-on-one via tutoring. A smart kid could learn all there was to know in 1-2 years using that method.

Modern society is simply a factory. To me what college does is keep kids out of the job market in modern civilization, I remember when I first started college I was told that by the prez of the college.

Obviously 'mike' has not been to college, and its obvious that dunc will always attempt to brain-fuck, and change the subject.

bruce said...

Buster, the link's not for you, it's for people that want to understand something you already claim to know. The show makes more sense than your ranting.

It's unregulated, no reserves insurance on other people's debt. It was legalized in 1999. It's ridiculous. The mp3 is excellent, well worth the listen. After today it won't be a free download.

Anonymous said...

90% of Americans in 1900 owned their own business? Sounds bogus to me. Got anything to back it up?

*

of course that is bullshit HBM, but like I responded to 'mike', if you consider that 90% of the USA lived on squatted ( injun land ), and grew their own food, ... and lived in poverty, and just got by, I guess you could call them an 'entrepreneur', this is typical PUG mythology.

Certainly in the days of all USA, there was NOT so much URBAN living, urban came with the industrial revolution. In 1900 a lot of the USA lived rural, grew their own food, and barely survived. Only a PUG could describe this as a sucessful businessman.

Getting back to 'richest man in babylon' since the dawn of time 97% of all humanity, in all civilizations to date, have lived a life of squalor, and begged, and borrowed to make it day to day, in any society on 3% make it, and save, and build, and live like free-men. This would be my defnition of a business-man.

Living in a rabbit-hole in the 1900's, and having a patch of potatoes growing to feed a dying wife, and children is hardly a business, but I'm sure PALIN would tell you so.

Anonymous said...

Here's an idea, given that todays subject is obviously 'subsistence living'.

Most of Bend's townfolk will not be driven from their homes for some years.

They can grow potatoes to feed their family, per marge, ...

They'll all be business-men, and the BULL can point out that some 90% of Bend are self-employed businessmen, cuz they squat in their STD shack, and grow their own food to eat.

Anonymous said...

It's unregulated, no reserves insurance on other people's debt. It was legalized in 1999.

*

It's been around forever BP, you like to create this myth that there was no human history prior to 1999, thats a recurring BP theme.

People have been horse trading insurance policy's, since insurance policy's were first written.

The thing that has happened post-buffett ( berkshire ), who invented the modern notion that insurance premiums can be used to gamble on wall-street, is now the WALL between insurance, banking, and wall-street has been torn down, so that when anyone of the three fall, they all fall. This what is happening today.

A hundred years ago, insurance was ran by conservative people. Not gamblers. In the 1960's (BUFFET) wall-street said "LOOK FREE MONEY(PREMIUMS) WE CAN INVEST".

BP says something got 'legalized' in 1999, that doesn't mean fucking shit, as insurance policy's have always been horse-traded, and Credit-Swap-Defaults are just insurance policys.

Quimby said...

I'm not sure Mike isn't the real deal. If Mike IS dunc though, he's good at the persona game!

My "welcome back cotter" poke was at the person engaging my silly off-kilter sense of humor. And I find Dunc a kindred spirit in the humor dept. That's all.

Anonymous said...

The problem with people like Buster is they think that if somebody knows how to make money he knows all there is to know.

*

Buster never said that. What buster says is "MONEY IS LIKE, PUSSY, or AIR, Its ONLY important, when you ain't getting any".

Now how does one get PUSSY & MONEY??

That is what we write about.

But like air, if you have it, you take it for granted.

Only people who don't have MONEY dwell on it, and HBM like HOMER is a poverty PIMP.

Anonymous said...

If Mike IS dunc though, he's good at the persona game!

*

It's fairly common in the world of internet. I'm sure me & you quim, could create 100's of persona's, and I'm sure that over 1/2 the persona's here are all one person.

I have always felt that HOMER was dunc, ...

Too me its about ideas, and trading rumors about Bend.

That's why I like 'anonymous' because names or labels don't mean shit, on the other end of the continuum you have the PUSSY who loves his own name.

«Oldest ‹Older   1 – 200 of 452   Newer› Newest»