I'm just curious, Why? Even old farts like Buster, who seem to loathe California, its inhabitants, and all it represents, defends the economic impenetrability of The Bay Area. Why?
Is it because the Bay seems to emerge from each downturn of the past, stronger & more vibrant than it ever was? Really? This can be said about many places & organizations and people.
The Bay is ALREADY as bad off as Bend:
Bay Area home prices fall by 22%
The median price of a home in the San Francisco Bay Area tumbled 21.7 percent in May to the lowest level in nearly four years, a real estate research firm said Wednesday.
The annual decline drove the median price to $517,000 in the nine-county region, according to DataQuick Information Systems.
The median price was $660,000 in May 2007 and $510,000 in September 2004.
Last month's drop was fueled by a surge in sales of heavily discounted foreclosed homes, a trend that appears to be building across many inland areas of the state.
Earlier this week, DataQuick reported the median home price in May plunged 26.7 percent to $370,000 in a six-county region of Southern California.
Despite increased sales of foreclosed homes, overall home sales in the San Francisco Bay Area notched their slowest pace for any May in DataQuick records, which go back to 1988.
Some 6,216 new and resale homes were sold last month, down 23.1 percent from May 2007, when 8,080 homes were sold, the firm said.
Sales declined 1.5 percent last month from 6,310 in April. The median price remained flat during the same period.
Some 25.6 percent of the homes resold last month had been foreclosed on sometime in the previous 12 months, up from only 3.3 percent in May last year, the firm said.
In Solano County, where the median home price sank 31 percent to $300,000 compared with the year-ago period, more than half of all resold homes were foreclosed properties.
In Contra Costa County, which saw its median home price tumble by nearly 34 percent to $390,500 compared with last year, foreclosed homes accounted for 43.3 percent of all homes resold.
In contrast, foreclosures made up only 5.8 percent of resold homes in San Francisco County, where the median price slipped 5.4 percent to $790,000 since May 2007.
Six Southern California counties experienced a similar trend. Nearly 38 percent of all the homes sold in the region last month were in foreclosure at some point during the past 12 months.
So San Fran proper seems to be holding up relatively well, but I do not expect this to last. Yup, I know, limited space, international demand, impenetrable, etc, etc. The surrounding disaster will breach the San Fran walls. Believe it.Similarly, it was only 1 short year ago that money center banks and the Wall St investment houses would escape the credit crunch relatively unscathed. Here's Citicorp, the 800lb gorilla of financial services for the last 25 years:
It's DAMN EASY to sit here, look out the side window, and make "predictions". Even "predicting" something like Lehman or Merrill going down at this point is not that much of a stretch.
I guess I don't give a fuck if people agree with me or not on the idea that San Fran is going down hard, but I do find it interesting that EVERYDAY this thing seems to reveal a new level of financial rot in this country. But they still believe that certain small sectors are immune.
If you're going from past experience, then you're being led astray. San Fran is THE White Hot Center of long-term collapse in the wildly over-leveraged financial system of this country. Don't believe it if you don't want to.
Speaking of collapsing mega-bubbles, we saw Cracker Ass Cracker Broke (CACB) slump to new multi-year lows, hitting the $7's.
You can see that at current prices, CACB has had a net gain of a buck or 2 over the last decade. Incredibly, MossCo, like a cancerous goiter, remains.
The regional banks continue to be the hated pariahs of the collapsing housing market.
Fallout From Bad Loans Rocks Regional Banks
In Ohio, the Panic of 1907 drove the Fifth National Bank into the arms of the Third National Bank, creating the singularly named Fifth Third Bank of Cincinnati.
But today Fifth Third and other regional banks across the nation are being shaken to the core by a 21st century financial crisis. For many of them, things are going from bad to worse.
Home mortgages and other loans that the banks made in good times are souring so fast that many of the lenders are scrambling to prop themselves up. If the pain worsens — and many analysts say it will — some of these banks, like Fifth Third’s predecessors, may eventually seek out suitors, most likely large national rivals.
For now, however, no one seems to want the regional banks. Stock market investors are deserting them en masse. On Wednesday, Fifth Third’s share price plunged 27 percent to $9.26, its lowest level in more than a decade, after the bank said it would cut its dividend and seek to raise $2 billion. Other financial stocks, particularly regional banks’ shares, also tumbled. The Standard & Poor’s 500 Regional Banks Index sank 6.8 percent.
“Everybody is trying to figure out where the bottom is,” said Jennifer Thompson, a regional bank analyst for Portales Partners in New York. “Every time a bank reports another capital raise or reports that things are worse than they anticipated, there is another round of selling.”
But Wednesday was just one more bad day in what has been a horrible year for small and midsize banks. Their descent in the stock market has been remorseless, reflecting the economic pain in their own backyards. Weakening housing and construction markets in regions like the Midwest, Southeast and Southwest have hit lenders in those areas hard.
For the banks’ shareholders, the numbers tell a sad story: Wednesday’s decline brought the loss for the S.& P. bank index to 39.3 percent so far this year. Fifth Third’s odd name almost seems like a bad joke. Fifth Third has lost two-thirds of its value this year. Shares of two other banks based in Ohio, the National City Corporation, of Cleveland, and Huntington Bancshares, of Columbus, have suffered similar declines.
Banks based in the Southeast are hurting, too. The Regions Financial Corporation, the biggest bank in Alabama, has lost half its value. Standard & Poor’s predicted this week that Regions would cut its dividend to conserve its capital in the face of rising losses on real estate loans. The share price of SunTrust Banks, which operates across the Southeast, has fallen almost 41 percent.
Small and midsize lenders are in far less danger than they were during the 1980s and early 1990s, when about 1,600 federally insured institutions failed during a savings and loan crisis. But the breadth and depth of the current troubles have caught bank executives by surprise. Federal regulators are particularly concerned about the exposure of smaller banks to the commercial real estate market, which has softened in some parts of the country.
But another worry is that raising money will become increasingly costly for banks that need capital. In a report issued this week, analysts at Goldman Sachs said banks might need as much as $65 billion on top of the $120 billion they have already raised.
But so far the vast majority of investors who bought into financial companies in the hope that the industry was out of the woods have lost, and lost big. As a result, many investors are reluctant to sink more money into regional banks, fearing their investments will be diluted if the banks sell even more stock. While many regional banks are trading far below their book values — at $4.83 on Wednesday, National City fetched just a fifth of its book value per share — many people are simply afraid to buy.
“You are in this death spiral of dilution,” said David Ellison, the chief investment officer of FBR Funds, a mutual fund company based in Arlington, Va. “It’s this toxic math.”
The need for new financing highlights the trouble many banks are having in selling assets like mortgages and home equity loans. They are trying to offload these assets to reduce amount of capital they are required to hold.
But more than anything, the problems confronting regional banks underscore the extent to which the housing crisis has spread throughout the country. In the Southeast, Regions and SunTrust are reeling from loosely underwritten mortgages now that real estate values are plummeting in the region.
In the West, Washington Mutual, the nation’s largest savings and loan, is being hurt by loans that it made to borrowers with shaky credit. Fremont General, the parent of a big subprime lender and a bank in California, filed for bankruptcy protection on Wednesday. Customers’ accounts, insured by the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation, are safe.
A handful of tiny banks have failed in small towns in Arkansas, Minnesota and Missouri. Rust Belt banks like National City and Fifth Third, in the meantime, have been stung by losses not only on their home turf but also in Florida, where they expanded in recent years. Initially, the push into Florida helped the banks increase growth rates as their hometown economies worsened. Now, these lenders are challenged on two fronts.
Bankers, who tried to assign innings to the credit crisis only a few months ago, are now resigned to participating in an extra-inning game. Several analysts now think that industry losses will not peak until next year.
“We have gone from shock and awe to blocking and tackling,” Mr. Ellison said.
And just to show you how the herd-mentality dominates Wall St; SunTrust Banks affirmed their dividend payout yesterday. Here's a graph of yesterdays trading action in the stock & I'll leave determining the timing of the news release as an exercise for the reader:
So SunTrust is an Atlanta based regional, but when they announced that they will be able to hang on to their 8.3% div yield for a few more months, well Wall St rallied the whole sector. Not just the Dukes of Hazard stuff in the SE, but all regionals, including our beloved CACB, got onboard the rally train.
This should tell you that many of these fund managers are driven almost completely by instinct.
Wow, if things are OK in Atlanta, they MUST BE OK in Florida! And if they're OK in Florida, then they're OK in AZ... and hell they gotta be OK in Cali. And even that Bend OR place my cousin told me about. Hey, maybe this credit crunch is actually coming to a close because some hick-ass regional down in the swamps is going to make one more liquidity-constricting payment to a bunch of mutual funds.
To date (ie, before the credit crunch), I have largely been mystified by the prescience of financial market participants. It's like they have crystal balls. Ahem. But something about this current implosion just seems to elude them. They will rally a regional in Central Oregon because of the cracker-ass decision of some nuts in Atlanta. Again, I don't get it.
And while the DJIA continues to fall, it isn't really suffering from massive collapse:
We're sitting near the lows of the year, down a little over 17% from the years highs. Financials, autos, airlines, home building, and just about anything involving leverage or having a gas tank getting killed.
But still, it doesn't really seem all that bad for the stock market. Is it exports keeping things alive? The dollar, after all, is trading like the peso. Buying our exports, and hell, our real assets, like bonds, stocks, and RE is cheap for just about everyone else in the World.
But things are going horribly wrong:
When will the market face reality?
Oil prices are soaring, inflation is raging, a recession is taking hold, and Wall Street continues to pretend the worst is over. But these problems won't just disappear.
Recently, I remarked that the stock market action has been echoing a familiar theme, whereby nothing seems to matter except the action itself. Some days, near euphoria on the part of bulls has trumped negative macro/corporate news and, more importantly, an economy that struggles as a result of the burst credit/housing bubble.
For a sense of that fantastical thinking, look no further than the recent spirited action in tech stocks. Their upside performance, as I have noted often, suggests a resurgence of the all-will-be-well mind-set.
Or, consider how all dips in oil inspire spikes in equities generically. Last Tuesday, as oil dropped a dollar to $134 a barrel, one would have thought -- judging by folks' giddiness for buying stocks -- that oil was closer to a six-month low than to an all-time high.
Eventually, though, reality will hit the stock market hard, just as it has hit the real- estate market, after much denial. When that happens, the market will head lower -- just how much lower is impossible to predict but certainly below the lows for the current cycle set in March.
Paper-trained bulls
Perhaps part of the strength in equities stemmed from folks' belief that the Federal Reserve will not tighten interest rates after all. (In last week's column, I noted that the chance of higher rates was essentially zero.)No fewer than four newspapers ran stories midweek to the effect that the Fed is unlikely to tighten at its meeting this week -- unless, to quote The Wall Street Journal (subscription required), "the inflation outlook deteriorates considerably."
Of course, when you look not at inflation but the "spun" version of inflation that's championed by the Fed, you can always find a reason to avoid raising rates. It continues to boggle my mind how anyone can think the Fed is serious about fighting inflation. The central bank is trapped -- unwilling to raise rates even as inflation ratchets higher-- because it (rightly) fears what higher rates would do to a weak economy.
Likewise, I find it stunning that anyone would take any prognostication by Alan Greenspan or Ben Bernanke, on any subject, as worthy of consideration, given that the past and present Fed chiefs, respectively, apparently understand nothing about what has been the engine of the economy for more than a decade -- that is, speculation.
Muzzle the (never-wuzza) maestro
Just last week, Greenspan could again be heard shooting off his mouth. He now sees the reduced possibility "of a deep recession" and said, regarding the mortgage crisis, that "the worst was over or soon would be" (as paraphrased by Bloomberg).What really made me burst out laughing was this headline (again on Bloomberg): "Risk managers should learn from market turmoil." What's so ironic is that the man who created the turmoil is the one person who has never seemed to learn anything.
Meanwhile, one can only wonder if any Fed heads (they, of the inflation-ex-energy-and-food camp) have gassed up their cars in the past several months. Of course, the bullish contingent still wants to believe that somehow the Fed will make inflation go away without raising interest rates and that somehow oil will trade lower -- thereby sustaining the fantasy that our economy will have a Goldilocks outcome.
Recently, a friend shared a noteworthy statistic: An oil exchange-traded fund is among the most heavily shorted ETFs in existence. In the first five months of this year, as oil rose 33%, the short interest soared 140%. Parenthetically, I might point out that another heavily shorted ETF happens to be SPDR Gold Shares (GLD, news, msgs).
I agree with Fleckenstein here. I think this country is going to undergo a fundamental transformation, where we "look" more like the rest of the World: Look at just about any BBC broadcast & you see about half the people on little scooters, not cars, and sure as hell NO SUV's. Little dinky-ass houses. A level of consumerism that is just quite a bit lower.Everyday, I hear about these supposed "intelligent" & "informed" high-level financial types calling "The End" of this little financial hiccup. Huh? These Ivory Tower types are clearly out of touch. This thing is nowhere near over.
Why Real Estate Market Is Nowhere Near a Bottom: Caroline Baum
Commentary by Caroline Baum
June 18 (Bloomberg) -- Every time a housing statistic emits a faint heartbeat -- last week's 6.3 percent increase in the April pending home sales index, for example -- there's a flurry of pronouncements that the residential real estate market has bottomed.
Hope springs eternal. Housing has been down so long it looks like up, especially with the graph turned upside down.
New and existing home sales peaked in July and September of 2005, respectively. It took a while for homebuilders to catch the drift: Starts didn't top out until January 2006, leaving a huge inventory of unsold homes in their wake.
Single-family starts, which are the most sensitive to changes in interest rates, are down 63 percent from the January 2006 peak, easily topping the 38 percent peak-to-trough decline in 1973-1975 and 57 percent 1984-1991 dive, and vying for first place with the 65 percent plunge in 1977-1981.
No wonder homebuilders are glum. In a departure from normal practices, the National Association of Homebuilders elected to release its monthly builder survey to the media via conference call on Monday. I received so many advance e-mail alerts I was starting to wonder if the index had sunk to zero in June, and the NAHB wanted to soften the blow.
The quantitative results weren't that bad: The housing market index fell 1 point to 18, matching the all-time low of December 2007.
The qualitative context was awful. David Seiders, NAHB chief economist, called the ``persistence of the low level'' of the HMI, a measure of housing demand, ``pretty troublesome.''
Price Option
The index ``has been in a tight range for a 10-month period,'' he said, ``unlike the 1990s, when there was a quick rebound. None (of the news) is encouraging at this point.''
As downbeat as Seiders was on the June survey results, the builder responses preceded ``the run-up in interest rates,'' he said. ``I haven't factored that into the outlook yet. The risks are piling up to the downside.''
While homebuilders are pressuring Congress to enact a tax credit for first-time buyers, they are resisting the one thing that requires no legislative action to spark buyer demand, according to Thomas Lawler, founder of Lawler Economic and Housing Consultants in Leesburg, Virginia: Cutting prices. ``Builders are reluctant to do that'' to compete with the growing volume of distressed sales of properties in various stages of foreclosure, he said.
Forget the Granite
In Southern California, for example, one of the areas where the bubble started early and ended hard, median home prices are down 27 percent in the past year, Lawler said.
``If you look at observed transactions on distressed sales, you could make a case that we are closer to a bottom because prices have plunged so rapidly,'' he said. ``But that's no solace to non-distressed prices.''
In Florida, another epicenter of the boom-bust in real estate, ``sales are 20 to 30 percent below year-ago levels, but prices haven't moved very much,'' Lawler said.
Builders have been reluctant to slash home prices for fear of alienating previous customers and encouraging current buyers to wriggle out of their contracts.
``Once clearing prices are way down, you can't attract buyers with granite countertops and gold trim,'' Lawler said.
Foreclosures rose to a record 2.47 percent in the first quarter, according to the Mortgage Bankers Association.
Future Inventory
Using the MBA and other data, Lawler calculates that there are 1.34 million one-to-four family first-lien mortgages in the foreclosure process, which amounts to 27 percent of the inventory of existing unsold homes. A year ago, foreclosures represented about 18 percent of the unsold inventory, he said.
As scary as that number sounds, so far it's just on paper. It takes about a year for today's foreclosures to be dumped on the market, adding to the already-bloated inventory of unsold homes, according to Michael Carliner, a former NAHB economist and now an independent housing economist in Potomac, Maryland.
The foreclosure process varies from state to state and in the length of time it takes from the first default notice to the assumption of the title of the property by the bank.
A few relationships are constant. New home sales lead housing starts. It is starts (residential construction) that contribute to gross domestic product. Housing's drag on growth won't lift until builders whittle away their backlog. Lower prices seem to be the quickest means to that end. (At lower prices, the quantity demanded increases.)
``We are unlikely to see a sustained increase in nationwide new home sales until builders are willing to cut prices to match the plunge in the prices of existing homes in seriously distressed areas,'' Lawler said.
If and when they do, you might not have to turn the home sales graph upside down to see the improvement.
(Caroline Baum, author of ``Just What I Said,'' is a Bloomberg News columnist. The opinions expressed are her own.)
To contact the writer of this column: Caroline Baum in New York at cabaum@bloomberg.net.
Finally, if you missed it, the perp walks have begun in the mortgage mess. Proving Yet Again, that the U.S. Government Regulatory System is totally powerless to prevent fraud, only to punish those involved when it is too late."Operation Malicious Mortgage" nets three in Portland area
Posted by bsherman June 19, 2008 11:43AM
More than 400 real estate industry players have been indicted since March -- including dozens over the last two days -- in a Justice Department crackdown on incidents of mortgage fraud that have contributed to the country's housing crisis.
The FBI put the losses to homeowners and other borrowers who were victims in the schemes at over $1 billion.
"Mortgage fraud and related securities fraud pose a significant threat to our economy, to the stability of our nation's housing market and to the peace of mind to millions of Americans," Deputy Attorney General Mark Filip said in a statement today.
In the Portland area, prosecutors highlighted three cases of alleged mortgage fraud, saying the defendants put together 200 or more questionable mortgage deals during the boom years.
A federal grand jury yesterday returned a 15-count indictment against Marty Folwick, of Portland. Folwick, 50, was charged with mail fraud, bank fraud and money laundering.
On the same day, prosecutors charged Lee Howlett, 45, also of Portland, with conspiracy to commit wire fraud, aggravated identify theft and money laundering.
And on May 27, prosecutors charged Jeremy Richardson, 31, of Ridgefield, Wash., with one count of wire fraud.
The three cases have much in common. All three of the defendants allegedly engineered a series of fraudulent mortgage deals with the help of straw buyers. They allegedly falsified loan applications to induce lenders to approve mortgage loans. Prosecutors claim some used bogus appraisals to justify higher loan amounts then the house was actually selling for and would then pocket the difference between the house price and loan amount.
Some also took kickbacks on each deal, prosecutors claim.
Folwick worked for Lighthouse Financial Group, a Vancouver, Wash. mortgage broker. He also ran his own company, MG Financial.
Prosecutors allege that Folwick took $180,000 in kickbacks for the five mortgage deals detailed in his indictment. Officials in the U.S. attorneys office in Portland are continuing to investigate Folwick and Lighthouse in the belief that he was involved in other questionable deals.
In a 2007 civil lawsuit, a lender claimed Folwick was involved in as many as 70 fraudulent mortgage deals.
Richardson alleged found his buyers on Craig's List. It is believed that Richardson did 100 or more mortgage deals. He allegedly used his clients' down payment money for various personal and business expenses.
Howlett worked for a company called Taylor Made Realty. His wife, Lisa Howlett, owned a mortgage company called Taylor Made Mortgage. It surrendered its license to the state in January 2007.
Since the beginning of March, 406 people have been arrested coast-to-coast in the sting dubbed "Operation Malicious Mortgage." Sixty people were arrested yesterday.
In a separate sweep, two former Bear Stearns managers in New York were indicted today, becoming the first executives to face criminal charges related to the collapse of the subprime mortgage market.
Nationwide, reports of mortgage fraud have soared over the past year as the subprime mortgage market collapsed and defaults and foreclosures soared.
-- Jeff Manning and Gordon Oliver; jmanning@news.oregonian.com
And some believe that Cali, and discussions of its market are irrelevant, but that just reveals an ignorance about the ties between there & here. Things are going horribly wrong everywhere, but CA and, by extension, Central Oregon, will be decimated for Many Years to come:State records biggest jump in unemployment
Saturday, June 21, 2008
(06-20) 15:25 PDT SAN FRANCISCO -- California's unemployment rate rocketed up by 0.6 percentage points in May - the largest one-month increase since the state began keeping records in 1976 - as the fallout from high energy prices and the depressed housing market rippled through the state's economy.
The state's jobless rate was a seasonally adjusted 6.8 percent, up from 6.2 percent in April, the California Employment Development Department reported Friday. That's the highest rate since November 2003, when California was recovering from recession.
Meanwhile, the total number of jobs in the state outside the farm sector declined by 10,900 in May, the third month in a row that payrolls shrank. Construction accounted for most of those losses, shedding 9,600 jobs during the month.
Economists cautioned that California's exploding unemployment rate may have been a statistical fluke that exaggerated the extent of the damage to the state's labor market.
The labor force showed unusual growth during the month, possibly because of large numbers of graduates leaving school and looking for work, they said. That could have skewed the jobless rate because the new workers would have been classified as unemployed until they got hired.
Still, there's little question that the job market has been contracting and that the state is on the edge of recession, if not actually in one, experts said.
"Some of (the jump in unemployment) was not real, but a fair amount of it was real," said Nancy Sidhu, senior economist with the Los Angeles County Economic Development Corp. "I am in the camp of people who say we are not in a recession yet, but we might be headed into one."
Payrolls in the state were down 49,600 in May from their level the year before, with the losses concentrated in construction, finance and manufacturing. That's a relatively small erosion of jobs compared with previous downturns.
"We haven't seen job growth fall off a cliff," said Ryan Ratcliff, an economist with the UCLA Anderson Forecast, which issued a report this week concluding that California's economy is weak, but not in recession.
In the Bay Area, which has been bolstered by technology and tourism, the job picture was brighter than in other areas of the state. But jobless rates rose throughout the region.
In the San Francisco metropolitan area, which includes Marin and San Mateo counties, unemployment was 4.6 percent in May, up from 4.2 percent the month before. In the San Jose area, the rate rose to 5.6 percent from 5.2 percent. And in the Oakland area, including Contra Costa and Alameda counties, unemployment was 5.7 percent, up from 5.3 percent.
"The Bay Area still is the best part of the California economy," said Howard Roth, principal economist for the California Finance Department. "But the bloom is off the rose."
Berkeley resident Phil Catalfo, 57, has been looking for work as an editor for almost a year, armed with a resume that shows experience as a top manager at such publications as Yoga Journal and Acoustic Guitar magazine. He has applied for several dozen jobs, but gotten few responses. One position that looked promising ended up getting filled internally.
"Companies I can tell are proceeding very cautiously," he said.
When Catalfo was looking for work three years ago, he was swamped with freelance jobs. This time, assignments are trickling in slowly.
"The air is definitely different," he said.
May's big jump in California unemployment was expected after the release of data two weeks ago that showed the national jobless rate leapt to 5.5 percent, up half a percentage point from April. Besides California, 17 other states had jobless-rate increases of 0.6 percent or more for the month, including five that had increases of a full percentage point or more.
Nationwide, only four states had jobless rates higher than California's, led by Michigan, where an ailing auto industry has pushed unemployment to 8.5 percent.
After release of the May employment report, Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger issued a statement calling on the Legislature to move forward on bond measures to fund infrastructure projects, putting more construction workers in jobs.
"An economic slowdown caused in part by our housing crisis is clearly still affecting California," he said.
So far, most of the job market's distress has stemmed directly from the housing crash. Construction and finance, which includes mortgage, real estate and title companies, together lost 123,000 jobs over the past 12 months. Sectors such as government, education, health and professional services grew substantially during the year.
Now there are worries that the weakness is spreading as high food and gas prices put a crimp on consumer spending. Jobs in retail trade have been disappearing for four months and are more than 15,000 below their level of a year ago, according to Stephen Levy, director of the Center for Continuing Study of the California Economy in Palo Alto.
"The job outlook ranges from flat to lower job levels a year from now, depending on the consumer," Levy wrote in an analysis.
6.8%
California's unemployment rate in May.
6.2%
California's unemployment rate in April.
4.6%
San Francisco metro area's jobless rate in May.
4.2%
San Francisco metro area's jobless rate in April.
10,900
Number of lost jobs statewide in May (excluding farms).
9,600
Number of lost construction jobs statewide in May.
8.5%
Michigan's rate of unemployment. Only four states had rates higher than California's.
E-mail Sam Zuckerman at szuckerman@sfchronicle.com.
My Watchword: Change. This country is going to be transformed by this "thing". The Great De-Leverging, Credit Crunch, Housing Debacle, whatever you wanna call it. It's a Seminal Event in the history of this country, maybe The Defining Event of Our Lives.
Expect The Unexpected. What's been true for 100 years, is all of a sudden Not True Anymore.
I wanted to end with a snippet of how hick-ass STUPID some of our local media really is:
Bend Housing Market Second Highest in U.S.Jun 20, 2008A new study released by a national real estate analyst group finds that Bend’s housing market was the second most overvalued market in the U.S., behind only Atlantic City, New Jersey, out of 330 cities studied and that as a whole the Pacific Northwest is “precariously overvalued and likely to be the next shoe to drop."
The housing valuation analysis, released by Massachusetts-based Global Insight, says the average home price in Bend runs about $290,500, which is overvalued by 49.5 percent, a slight decrease from first quarter 2007 when median home prices reached $319,900 and were overvalued by 65.7 percent, the study says.
In other words, the study claims a house in Awbrey Butte appraised at $500,000 is really worth only $250,000.
At least one local real estate observer says that is ridiculous.
Bill Robie, director of government affairs for the Central Oregon Association of Realtors, said the results of the study, and others like it that are released from time to time, are misleading because the methodology leaves out huge chunks of information that need to be considered when determining market prices – land permit fees, system development charges, the time it takes to build and the price of the land where the house will be built, to name a few.
“These kinds of statistics have come out before and they do not take into consideration the many local factors that contribute to Bend’s housing market prices,” Robie said.
Global Insight’s approach to determining the value of homes in Bend, and in every metro area covered by the study, considered the price of the house, interest rates, household incomes, population densities and any historical premiums or discounts exhibited over time by the city.
Global Insight examined those factors, accounting for 78 percent of all existing housing units in America and 93 percent of all related real estate value, to determine what housing prices should be, in this statistical sense, the study says.
Only eight metro areas, including Bend, were considered overvalued during first quarter 2008, down from a peak of 53 in 2006. Incidentally, California, Michigan and Florida continue to post the most severe losses, accounting for 45 of the 50 worst-performing metro areas, said Jeannine Cataldi, head of real estate services for Global Insight.
“The appearance of Northwestern states among the worst price performances vindicates our model performance, as we noted in previous reports that the Northwest seemed precariously overvalued,” Cataldi said.
A local news story that came out a few months ago highlighting a similar report used a similar index, but the problem with those studies is that the index used is inappropriate, Robie said.
“I don’t know the elements, or how they were put together, but I can’t imagine they apply directly to Central Oregon,” he said.
In fact, the methodology used by Global Insight does not apply directly to the Central Oregon market, Cataldi said. Rather, the results are meant to provide more of a general look at existing housing by examining housing density, income and mortgages in these 330 metro areas, among other factors.
“When you’re talking about the methodology of a study that looks at hundreds of metropolitan areas, getting into the specifics of each local area would take a long, long time,” Cataldi said. “Land-permit fees, the time it takes to build and other similar factors wouldn’t be taken into consideration because we are looking at existing home sales, not new construction.”
Bend traditionally has a lot of second home buyers and wealthy retirees in the market who can afford more expensive homes, which drives up the median price as well, and those factors are not figured into broad real estate studies either, Robie said.
And then there is the 800-pound gorilla in Bend’s real estate market – the city’s urban growth boundary, Robie said.
“Because we constrained the supply of available land, local prices can be very high,” Robie said. “There is very little land left to build on, which is why the city has been looking at doing an urban growth boundary expansion. From our perspective, in order to have any shot of mitigating a land price increase, we need to increase the UGB.”
For the past few months, the median price of homes for sale in Bend was above $300,000. It dipped down to $270,000 in April and then increased in May to $303,000, according to statistics released by the Central Oregon Association of Realtors.
In Redmond, the median sale price of a home increased from $225,000 in April to $245,000 in May. Sales in Redmond remained flat for most of the year, hovering somewhere between 30 to 40 sales per month and peaking at 50 in April.
In Crook County, median first quarter 2008 sale prices reached $207,000, up from $173,000 during the fourth quarter of 2007 and the number of sales declined from 45 to 20, respectively.
In related news, another report released on June 5 by the Mortgage Bankers Association, a Washington D.C.-based organization representing the real estate finance industry through the promotion of fair and ethical lending practice, finds that Oregon had the nation's sixth lowest rate of delinquent loans and the sixth lowest foreclosure rate during first quarter 2008.
Oregonians have about 635,000 outstanding mortgages, according to the report, and about 3 percent of those loans (19,000) are 30 days or more past due. Close to 6,000 Oregon loans, just less than 1 percent of all advances, are in some state of foreclosure.
The rate of delinquent mortgages in Oregon reached its lowest point in 1982 at 6.2 percent, which remains the highest recorded rate in 29 years. During the dot-com and telecom implosion of 2000 through 2001, the delinquency rate reached 3.7 percent.
State foreclosures were 2.2 percent in 1985, the highest on record, compared to 1.3 percent in 2002 just after the technology sector bust.
People holding adjustable rate, subprime mortgages, which are typically awarded to individuals with low credit scores or negative credit histories, remain worse off today than other borrowers. The MBA report finds that of the 32,000 subprime adjustable rate mortgages outstanding in Oregon, about 14.5 percent of them are delinquent.
Pamela "The Incredible Hulce" Andrews, a math lesson: When a $500K home is over-valued by 49.5%, it is NOT "really worth only $250,000". THAT would be 100% over-valued. A $500K overvalued by 49.5% is "really worth" about $334K.
Bend is doomed if, for no other reason, than we have dumbfucks like Hulce with their finger on The Button.I'll end it (again) with some Before & After:
Before: A company with decades of ever-increasing profits. This one looks like a rocket ride to the moon! Can it be stopped by some puny housing bubble bursting? What about the future can you divine from this chart?This blog started right there at Jan 2007. How bad could my timing be? AHH!
Flash forward to today! Mystery Company is Ambac, an insurance company basically that pays when investments go South on investors. Hows it gone for the past year?
Yeah, from the mid $90's just last year, Ambac has suffered a small haircut down to $2. This company had a market value of around $27 billion last year. Now it's a penny stock, worth almost as little as our humble CACB!
Here's a little player in the mortgage market. Had a $44 billion market cap. Guess who?
Yup, it's the old standby, Freddie Mac. They basically buy mortgages & then issue securities backed by said mortgages. Not going well now.
Yeah, FRE wipes $647 million in shareholder value for each dollar its share prices drops, which has happened about 50X over the past year.
Here's a little company you'd think really got it going on.
I can tell you they have a paltry 4.45 billion shares outstanding, which gives them a market cap of around $245 billion at $55/sh. Not bad. So how's it going now?
Yup, it's Bank of America, a little outfit with more bank branches than Bend has MILFy cougars. And that's a lot. That little dive at the end is loyal BAC shareholders having a decade of gains wiped clean. At $4.45 billion lost by BAC shareholders for each dollar cut from the shares... well, you can see it's starting to hurt a little.
I say again: If you play Before & After honestly, you can see that sometimes the past means little about the future. Will Bend collapse completely? Probably. Will San Fran follow? Maybe. But one thing is sure: No one's going to hang a fucking stock chart out that tells you the future, and going off past cycles to predict this one is ridiculous.
Will I change any minds on the San Fran issue? Fuck no, I don't even care to. It's simply an example that points to the continuing delusional perception that there are places that are IMMUNE to the credit collapse gripping the World. San Fan is SURROUNDED by financial rot, and like a termite infestation, it will make it to San Fran ultimately.
If you want to anchor on San Fran & rip me a new ass that's fine. But know that the past is probably The Worst Indicator of what's going to happen. San Fran As A Fortress is a bad idea to cling to. Was it in the past? Sure. So was Bend. We hung on longer before collapsing. Has that made the Bend collapse impossible? Look around.
Anyone defending San Fran As Immune sounds like a Bend Realtor circa 2006. I can no more prove it will happen than I can hold up an 2007 Ambac chart & prove that they would not succumb. It's not provable, and I won't try.
If you want to look out the side window, or worse the rear view mirror as a rationale that San Fran won't capitulate, I'm just telling you that you're not telling me anything I couldn't have lamely laid down myself. Saying San Fran will make it just fine is a lame way of framing something as a "prediction" that is really just an observation of the present.
Again, anchoring on a bunch of peninsula-bound mega-fags is not the idea; It's questioning LONG HELD assumptions about EVERYTHING. Places like SF have ALWAYS bounced back, bigger & better than ever. So has Ambac. Until now. Reflexively thinking the past will reliably repeat is WRONG THIS TIME.
It is FUCKING DIFFERENT THIS TIME. All prior beliefs will be challenged. Don't think so? Look at the stock market. Participants CONTINUE to call the bottom EVERY FUCKING DAY. Every day they FALL BACK on Past is Present.
"This will be like the Asian Crisis. Yeah. Quick dip, then to the moon. Reliable as day follows night. Or even 1987. Maybe a harder drop that really hurts. For awhile. Then up, up & away. OK. Maybe... MAYBE it'll be a NASDAQ-style slump. But anyone who bought right at the bottom is doing OK. If you timed that one wrong, you might have to wait another 10-15 years for breakeven, but that even seems a slam dunk..."
No. I just blink in disbelief at the market bulls wanting this thing to be over. They don't get it. 70% of the US lives in their own home, and wiping tens of thousands from ALL THOSE PEOPLE is unprecedented. Never even come close to happening before. Maybe The Great Depression.
What's happening now is A Game Changer. Ain't like the past. Sell the fucking rallies. Sell the strong. Rent & Invest The Diff. De-Leverage.
And just one more thing: This is about as close as you'll get to a verbalization of what Oregonians think of Cali-bangers, from "Paulina's charm":
“I don’t think this country really changed until eight, nine years ago,” he said. “It started changing when Californians started coming. There’s different rules — the population is just changing.”
In case you're wondering Cali-bangers, this means Fuck You & Get The Fuck Out. THAT is the "charm" of Paulina; They hate you fuckers, and are just ass-backwards enough to get away with a print quote like that in The Bulletin. The rest of us hate you too, but they'd never print something like that from a metro-banger Bendite sophisticate.
205 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 1 – 200 of 205 Newer› Newest»Good piece about used bookstores in The Bulletin today:
Selling used books the old-fashioned way
2 Bend bookstores find ways to thrive in a tight economy
Median home price in California drops 30% in May
The figure falls to $339,000, the steepest monthly decline in at least two decades. That's drawing an influx of first-time buyers.
From the Associated Press
June 19, 2008
Foreclosures helped fuel the sharpest decline in California housing prices in at least 20 years last month, and that's attracting an influx of first-time buyers who had been priced out of the market or were waiting for prices to bottom out.
The median home price in California plunged 30% to $339,000 in May, the steepest decline for any month going back to 1988, when DataQuick Information Systems began keeping records.
Home buyers are now seeing median prices they haven't seen since February 2004, when the price was $322,500, the firm said Wednesday. The statewide median home price, the point at which half the homes sold for more and half for less, peaked at $484,000 in May 2007.
"All of a sudden, [homes] are in our price range," said Elizabeth Trezza, a paralegal in Oakland.
Trezza has been on the hunt for a foreclosed property and placed offers on at least six in recent weeks.
The 24-year-old made an offer Tuesday on a two-bedroom, two-bath bank-owned home in Oakland listed at $234,000 -- just below her maximum spending limit, $250,000.
"Right now our mortgage would be relatively close to what we pay for in rent," she said.
For California, epicenter of the nation's housing boom and bust, the drop in home prices has sparked a home-buying rally that's beginning to reverse more than two years of monthly year-over-year sales declines.
Though observers are cautious to call the surge in foreclosure sales a bellwether for a wider turnaround, it suggests some buyers are feeling less skittish about diving back into the market.
"Inland markets hit hardest by foreclosures and falling prices are now the most likely to post higher sales than last year," said Andrew LePage, a DataQuick analyst. "These communities have been attracting first-time buyers, first-time move-up buyers and investors."
Prices in those markets are now more in line with family incomes, and some buyers feel they are getting better deals, LePage said.
Sue Ansel, chief operating officer of Gables Residential, a luxury apartment rentals operator, says she has seen an uptick this year in renters moving out to become homeowners.
DataQuick said a total of 33,024 homes were sold statewide in May, down nearly 11% from a year earlier. About 38% of the resold homes in May were foreclosed properties.
Some foreclosure hunters are finding themselves having to bid against rival buyers on properties, said Richard Cosner, president of Prudential California Realty.
"Homes that are $200,000 to $250,000 today were $400,000 18 months ago," Cosner said. "For the first-time home buyers and for that bottom tier of homes, we've found what the bottom of the pricing is."
Homes priced below $400,000 drove the surge in sales. Many were financed with loans backed by the Federal Housing Administration, mortgage brokers say.
"FHA financing has really skyrocketed," said Dustin Hobbs, a spokesman for the California Mortgage Bankers Assn.
Sales, on the other hand, were weakest in many higher-end coastal markets, where there are fewer foreclosed homes and sellers are more reluctant to cut prices.
In San Francisco, for example, foreclosures made up only 5.8% of resold homes. The median home price there slipped 5.4% to $790,000 last month.
In contrast, more than half of all resold homes last month in nearby Solano County were foreclosed properties, DataQuick said.
That helped drive the median home price down by about 30% to $300,000 compared with May last year.
The median home price in California plunged 30% to $339,000 in May...
The statewide median home price, the point at which half the homes sold for more and half for less, peaked at $484,000 in May 2007.
That is a truly unprecedented loss of wealth, almost $150K PER HOUSE. It's almost certainly MORE than that though, because the appropriate statistic is the MEAN, not median.
That's the rub: To end this debacle, prices will have to just plummet, so that "normals" can actually afford to buy a home again. Last 4-5 years, that's been impossible for the financially responsible.
Cali is going to get BANGED so hard on this thing. Ask Ed McMahon.
Reuters
Fed's tough inflation talk hits housing
Thursday June 19, 2:53 pm ET
By Mark Felsenthal
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The U.S. Federal Reserve's recent tough talk on inflation served notice to financial markets that the central bank was serious about tamping down price pressures, but it has hit the economy in one of its tenderest spots -- housing.
Markets took immediate heed of surprisingly strong comments delivered by Fed Chairman Ben Bernanke and Vice Chairman Donald Kohn on inflation earlier this month and began to judge chances of a rate hike at the Fed's August meeting a near certainty.
But a side effect of this new respect for the central bank's commitment to price stability came in the form of elevated longer-term interest rates, which reflects a steeper than previously expected march up in the overnight borrowing costs that the Fed controls.
These higher long-term rates on Treasury securities have quickly translated to higher rates for fixed-rate mortgages, a drop in mortgage applications and a slide in home loan refinancing that could push the prospect of a strengthening in anemic economic conditions further into the future.
"The Fed's tougher line on inflation has had some benefits in terms of the firmer dollar, and has taken some of the steam out of commodity prices," said Mark Zandi, chief economist for Moody's Economy.com. "But it also has created some problems, the most obvious being ... another hit to the already fragile housing market."
FINE-TUNING THE MESSAGE
The Fed may have been taken aback by the degree to which markets built in chances of rate hikes after Bernanke promised to "strongly resist" a rise in inflation expectations and Kohn said a rise in anticipated price increases over the longer term would be "troublesome."
In a sign the Fed may worry it overplayed its hand, anonymous senior officials and sources close to Bernanke were cited in newspaper reports this week as saying markets may have overreacted to hawkish Fed rhetoric.
The Fed would respond aggressively if inflation expectations spiked, but some Fed officials believe rates should hold steady if those elevated expectations do not materialize, the Financial Times said in one report.
The apparent efforts by the Fed to fine-tune its message came just shortly before its June 24-25 policy-setting meeting.
While the Fed is widely expected to hold interest rates steady next week, it may signal that its concerns have begun to move away from risks to growth and toward the risk of inflation.
BALANCING ACT
In doing so, the Fed faces a delicate balancing act and the difficult task of offering a clear signal to financial markets as it tries to both tamp down inflation risks and nurse the economy back to health at a time oil prices have hit a record high near $140 a barrel.
"It is hard to talk down inflation expectations without talking up real interest rates," former Fed Governor Laurence Meyer and former Fed researcher Brian Sack of Macroeconomic Advisers said in a research note. Expectations of higher rates could shave a quarter-percentage point off U.S. gross domestic product over the next four quarters, they said.
"The (Fed), of course, was well aware of this risk and felt it was outweighed by the benefit of capping inflation expectations," Meyer and Sack wrote.
Housing is at the heart of woes afflicting the sluggish economy. In each of the last two quarters, home building has fallen at an annual rate of more than 25 percent.
Reflecting rising worries about inflation, the yield on benchmark 10-year Treasury note leaped to a peak near 4.29 percent on June 13 from around 3.90 percent two weeks ago. Since last Friday, the 10-year Treasury's yield has settled back to about 4.20 percent.
A report on Wednesday showed rates for 30-year fixed rate mortgages -- which closely track the 10-year Treasury -- averaged 6.57 percent in the week ended June 13, up 33 basis points and the highest since July 2007. Mortgage applications dropped for the fourth week in the last five on higher rates, the Mortgage Bankers Association said.
But despite the moderation of its message, the Fed is signaling that now that the worst of the financial market crisis appears to be over, it would tolerate sluggish growth to wring inflation from the system.
"At the end of the day, if inflation expectations start to rise, they're going to tighten," Zandi said. "They have that credibility, and that's what everyone believes they're going to do."
(Reporting by Mark Felsenthal; Editing by Jan Paschal)
Now we're in a tough spot: Ridiculous lending led to non-payment on millions of mortgages. Bernanke eased, essentially giving away trillions via investment bank loans, buying Bear Stearns, etc. We've been flooded with dollars over the past 6 months, raising the specter of inflation. Now they are looking at raising rates to counter inflation, but higher rates actually KILLS home prices, and letting inflation go will do a lot of bad things, primary of which is raise unemployment, which of course just exacerbates the problem.
Rock & A Hard Place. Nothing to do now but let it take its course. Should have just let it happen 6 months ago...
D.C. Region's Foreclosure Rate Soars
Sixfold Increase Surpasses Most Hot Spots in Country
By Philip Rucker
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, June 19, 2008; A01
The Washington region now has one of the fastest-growing foreclosure rates in the nation, as 15,613 homes went into foreclosure during the one-year period ending in February, an analysis to be released today has found.
Although communities have felt the effects of the housing crisis for months, the report reveals that foreclosures in the Washington region have been increasing at a surprisingly quick pace, outstripping those of most major metropolitan areas. Over the past year, the number of foreclosures per 10,000 homes jumped from 23 to 131 locally, while the national average increased from 58 to 87.
The nation's hardest-hit areas of Phoenix, Miami and San Francisco have a greater share of homes in foreclosure, but the sixfold increase in the Washington area tops that of any other region in the report, commissioned by the Metropolitan Washington Council of Governments and Freddie Mac.
"While foreclosures were practically nonexistent in the Washington area 18 months ago, it's now very prevalent, and we're above the national average," said the report's author, John McClain, deputy director of George Mason University's Center for Regional Analysis.
Although Prince William and Prince George's counties have experienced the most home foreclosures, the report identifies several communities as potential "hot spots" for future foreclosures, including Centreville, Falls Church, Herndon and Vienna in Fairfax County, Germantown and Olney in Montgomery County and Adams Morgan in the District.
The Council of Governments is establishing an emergency fund with private contributions to support nonprofit groups that provide mortgage counseling and money for shelter, food and utilities for affected families.
"We're all trying to figure out where is the bottom, and I think the story shows that we're probably not there yet," said Montgomery County Council President Michael Knapp (D-Upcounty), who also chairs the Council of Governments. "We're going to need to work within our individual jurisdictions and collectively come up with some strategies to deal with it. We can't ignore it."
The region's crisis ballooned in part, McClain said, because a large stock of new homes was sold to many first-time home buyers, some of them immigrants, under loans with adjustable rates. When their monthly payments increased, many home buyers were unable to keep up, which led to foreclosures.
"Where you've had more immigrants, they are after the American dream, and as soon as they can buy a house, that's what they're doing," McClain said. "In many cases, they're overreaching."
His research suggests that foreclosures will increase until at least early next year, largely because of decreasing home values. "When the price of housing drops to an extent that the amount you owe is more than the house is worth, if you don't have a lot of equity, there is a tendency to walk away from it and just have it foreclosed," McClain said.
The analysis found that the steepest declines in home sale prices, between April 2007 and April 2008, occurred in the outer suburban ring, defined as Loudoun, Prince William and Frederick counties. The average price there dropped by $110,900, or 25 percent. The inner ring, Fairfax, Montgomery and Prince George's, had a decline of 3.2 percent. The core, defined as the District, Arlington County and Alexandria, experienced an increase of 3.4 percent.
The study did not include Southern Maryland or Howard and Anne Arundel counties, which are not members of the regional council.
David Robertson, the council's executive director, said the foreclosure crisis demands that local governments, businesses and nonprofit groups respond in concert as they did after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.
Fairfax Board of Supervisors Chairman Gerald E. Connolly (D) agreed. "If we can come up with a concentrated effort to address this problem, I think we have a better chance of making a positive impact," he said.
At a regional foreclosure summit today, the Nonprofit Roundtable of Greater Washington will present a report that highlights the work of agencies on the front lines of the crisis. Many reported being inundated with families facing foreclosure or having been ordered from their homes.
The Latino Economic Development Corp., a District-based nonprofit organization, opened a Wheaton office in March to provide foreclosure counseling.
"We anticipated having just 60 cases for the entire year, and within four weeks we had 130 cases," Executive Director Manny Hidalgo said. "Not everybody's going to be able to rework their mortgage or restructure their loan, but we try to save as many as we can."
United Communities Against Poverty in Prince George's provided mortgage help to 21 families in 2006. That number rose to 44 last year, and this year the group has served 158, program manager Mary Clark said.
The story is the same in Northern Virginia, where Reston Interfaith is training its social workers to provide mortgage counseling.
The Council of Governments' emergency fund will help groups such as these. Freddie Mac, the McLean-based mortgage company, is donating $175,000 to the fund. The Freddie Mac Foundation is giving $100,000, foundation Chairman Ralph F. Boyd Jr. said.
"Foreclosure obviously puts everybody at risk," Boyd said. "It puts families at risk, it puts neighborhoods at risk, communities at risk, the lenders at risk."
Coalition defies White House on foreclosure rescue bill
WASHINGTON (AP) — A broad bipartisan coalition supporting a massive foreclosure rescue beat back GOP efforts to gut it Thursday, defying a White House veto threat and quashing a bid to make it victim to revelations about two senators' VIP mortgages.
Administration officials said they oppose the inclusion of $4 billion in the measure to help states buy and rehabilitate foreclosed properties, and a plan to have government-sponsored mortgage giants Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac pay for the rescue.
They announced those and other objections as two GOP senators said they would try to block the package until a committee can investigate how much Countrywide Financial Corp. and other lenders stand to gain from it.
House and Senate Republicans are voicing reservations about the bill in light of allegations that Senate Banking Committee Chairman Christopher J. Dodd, D-Conn., one of its architects, and Senate Budget Committee Chairman Kent Conrad, D-N.D., got cut-rate home loans through a VIP program at Countrywide, a leading subprime lender at the center of the mortgage meltdown.
Both said they neither sought nor knew about the special treatment.
"This bill has come together in such a way as to raise questions all over this country that we need to answer before we move ahead," Sen. Jim DeMint, R-S.C., said.
The Senate rejected, 70-11, the move by DeMint and Sen. Jim Bunning, R-Ky., to send the housing package back to Dodd's panel which would have essentially killed the measure.
The election-year bill, which could help hundreds of thousands of struggling homeowners, appeared to be drawing wide bipartisan backing.
The Senate overwhelmingly defeated two amendments by Sen. Christopher S. "Kit" Bond, R-Mo., that would have derailed the measure. Both failed on margins large enough to override a promised veto, suggesting the plan could survive a showdown with President Bush.
Dodd and Sen. Richard C. Shelby of Alabama, the senior Banking Republican, said the veto threat was "disappointing," given that their compromise plan includes several elements Bush has demanded, and said they hoped the White House would reconsider.
"It's baffling why the White House would oppose a bill that would help so many American families at risk of losing their homes on the same day hundreds of mortgage fraud arrests were announced," said Barack Obama, the presumptive Democratic presidential nominee.
One of Bond's proposals, which failed on a 69-21 vote, would have killed the foreclosure rescue. The other, defeated 77-11, would have essentially doomed an affordable housing fund financed by Fannie and Freddie, leaving it — and the mortgage aid plan — without a source of money.
Democrats and many Republicans consider the measure a political imperative amid rising foreclosures and growing public anxiety about the sagging economy.
Its centerpiece is a foreclosure rescue program in which the Federal Housing Administration would provide $300 billion in new, cheaper mortgages for distressed homeowners who otherwise would be considered too financially risky to qualify for government-insured, fixed-rate loans.
Borrowers would be eligible if their mortgage holders were willing to take a substantial loss and allow them to refinance, and would ultimately have to share with the government a portion of any profits they made from selling or refinancing their properties.
The measure is designed to help hundreds of thousands of borrowers in danger of losing their homes, but it also would benefit mortgage holders by allowing them to avoid costly foreclosures and reclaim some of what they're owed by people facing financial ruin.
The bill would tighten controls on Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac — which provide huge amounts of cash flow to the mortgage market by buying home loans from banks — creating a new regulator for the firms.
It also would provide a $14.5 billion array of housing and other tax breaks, including a credit of up to $8,000 for first-time homebuyers who buy a home in the next year, and boosts in low-income tax credits and mortgage revenue bonds.
A group of 28 House Republicans wrote to Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., on Thursday demanding an investigation — with open hearings — on the Countrywide allegations.
"At a time when millions of Americans are struggling to repay their mortgage debts while coping with $4/per gallon gasoline and soaring foods prices, they will be outraged to learn that some members of Congress may have personally profited from their official positions through secret sweetheart deals on their mortgages," said the letter, signed by House leaders.
They called the revelations "extremely troubling" in light of upcoming votes on the housing package.
Rep. Barney Frank, D-Mass., the House Financial Services chairman, said his panel won't look into the Countrywide case, given the panel's already full schedule and a pending Senate Ethics Committee probe of the matter.
He defended Dodd in a statement, saying, "At no point in any of our joint efforts has Senator Dodd shown even the slightest indication that he was in any way influenced by considerations other than what was best for the economy and the American people."
Still, Frank and other Democrats have serious concerns about the Senate housing measure that could frustrate leaders' desire to send it to Bush before Congress breaks for a week-long July 4 vacation.
Brace for other shoe to drop in mortgage mess, some warn
Borrowers one tier above subprime could produce next wave of defaults
By Michael Shaw
Sacramento Business Journal
Sacramento Business Journal
updated 1:00 a.m. PT, Wed., June. 18, 2008
With most of the country still reeling from the subprime mortgage meltdown, Mark Hanson is warning of the next looming blow.
Hanson, a bank consultant and former mortgage broker from the Bay Area who writes a blog under the name "Mr. Mortgage," is among a handful of industry soothsayers who expect another big wave of foreclosures to hit sometime around 2010, driven by defaults among people holding less risky loans known as "alternative-A."
Subprime is the term applied to loans given to people with shaky credit. Alt-A is the next-higher category, typically covering mortgages to borrowers who had better credit but didn't want to document their incomes or wanted an initial period of low payments, often covering only the interest on the loan. Technically the term "alt-A" applies to securities backed by the loans, but it has come to be used for the mortgages themselves.
While defaults have been creeping up in the alt-A category this year, the foreclosures that have wracked the housing market so far have been largely the result of defaults among subprime borrowers.
"I think we are through the subprime blowup, but that's nothing compared to what's coming," said Hanson, who made similar predictions on CNN in April.
His theory is that other borrowers will follow the path of subprime borrowers, who started defaulting when their mortgage interest rates reset to higher levels. Many alt-A borrowers face a bump in their monthly payments starting mid-2010, according to financial services company Credit Suisse. The firm's figures, reported in the International Monetary Fund's report on global financial stability, show a big bubble of U.S. mortgage rate readjustments hitting during that time period, including borrowers with "option ARM" loans that allow a borrower to initially make payments that are so low the balance increases.
Others in the industry say such predictions amount to Chicken Little panic.
"I hear that, too -- that there's another subset of groups that haven't come due yet," said Jeff Tarbell, broker of record for Sacramento's Comstock Mortgage. But Tarbell said he's not concerned about a second foreclosure tsunami because borrowers who owe more than their homes are worth aren't waiting for their mortgage rates to reset. Those inclined to bail are already doing so, he said.
By the numbers
A record $400 billion in alt-A loans was issued in 2006, according to data by specialty publisher Inside Mortgage Finance, cited in published reports. Alt-A accounted for 13.4 percent of all mortgages offered that year. Hanson said lenders first started pushing them in 2005 as a way for buyers to combat skyrocketing prices and continued issuing them into 2007 despite the subprime concerns.
Some of the largest issuers of these loans were IndyMac Bank, Washington Mutual Bank, Countrywide Financial and World Savings Bank (now part of Wachovia Corp.).
As of January, California has more alt-A loans than subprime loans on the books -- about 728,000 alt-A loans and 496,000 subprime loans among 12.2 million housing units -- according to data from a division of research firm First American CoreLogic Inc., posted on the Federal Reserve Bank of New York's Web site. The division, LoanPerformance, reported that 83 percent of those California alt-A loans were granted with little or no documentation.
In December, the most recent local data posted, there were 48,500 alt-A loans in the four-county Sacramento region.
California's subprime borrowers are defaulting at 2.4 times the rate of alt-A borrowers, according to LoanPerformance. However, late last month, Standard & Poor's issued a warning that alt-A delinquencies are on the rise. Specifically, the ratings agency said the number of serious delinquencies, such as homes with payments 90 days overdue or in foreclosure, rose as much as 10 percent in the span of a month.
Upside-down finances
Those projecting a second foreclosure wave believe negative equity -- a situation where a homeowner owes more than a house is worth -- is a prime driver of foreclosures. A study released by the Federal Reserve Bank of Boston found that negative equity is a "necessary but not sufficient condition" for a buyer to default.
It's not clear whether borrowers whose mortgage payments could double by 2010 are determined to stay put until then.
Irvine-based RealtyTrac Inc., an online service that tracks foreclosed properties, said that it and its competitors can't tell if borrowers have a subprime, alt-A or prime loan when they default.
"More affluent borrowers may be more likely to walk because they understand investing," Hanson contends.
Tarbell, who hosts the weekly "Talking Money with Jeff Tarbell" on KHTK-AM 1140, said upside-down borrowers looking at the prospect of an interest rate reset in a couple of years called his show frequently early this year, and seemed unlikely to sit tight until their loans reset.
"It's like I'm Dr. Phil," he said. "I'm doing grief counseling. They have realized they are in a negative equity situation and they're not going to sit around and wait. How many people are going to be willing to double their monthly payment when they're upside-down on the house?"
If Hanson's theory holds up, it's bad news for California homeowners just as the country's foreclosure problems are easing slightly.
According to Sacramento's Foreclosures.com, the number of repossessed homes fell in May in California for the first time since November. The Web site reported that foreclosures in Sacramento and Placer counties fell slightly in May compared with April, but were still much higher than a year ago.
Hanson, who was a wholesale mortgage broker for 20 years, bristles when alt-A is described as lying between subprime and prime. "That's like saying Pasadena lies between L.A. and Las Vegas," he said. He considers alt-A to be a suburb of Subprime City.
"It's not hard to get a 700 credit score," he said, citing a typical score for an alt-A borrower when the loans were being widely offered. "If you had a Macy's card and a gas card, you could buy an $800,000 home."
I don't think anyone ever called the Bay Area immune. We have said that it has good long term employment prospects,good quality of life and that we would rather live there than some rust bucket midwest shithole. If I had to live and invest in either the Bay Area or Wichita 'til I die I'd take the Bay Area....or just die now.
Take a break..this was a weak straw man effort. Bring back baby jeebus
this was a weak straw man effort.
We'll see.
We have said that it has good long term employment prospects,good quality of life and that we would rather live there than some rust bucket midwest shithole.
I'm not at all convinced about the L/T employment prospects.
"Good quality of life"? That sort of thing is largely fleeting. NYC had a Good Quality of Life till it went broke & crime broke out. Then it had a horrendous quality of life.
I sorta doubt a lot of people here have lived in a "rust bucket" midwest town... or even visited. I lived in the midwest almost my entire adult life, and some is good, some is bad. But if it meant living in a nice 3,000 sf home I paid $165K for, so I could use my excess cash to visit HI, or some other place I REALLY like (not San Fran), vs living wall-to-fucking-wall with a bunch of liberal wage slaves in dinky-ass $2,500/mo apartments (face it: No one can afford to buy in Frisco), I will take the former.
I question the Quality of Life argument.
And again... this is LESS about Frisco, and more about questioning L/T beliefs about the after-effects of this Great De-Leveraging, and why people have ingrained biases about certain places & events.
I don't give a fuck if Frisco & it's band of shrieking ass fags falls into the ocean. It's this: Why anyone would hold San Fran (or JP Morgan) immune from this thing is what I'm asking here.
DC has started to succumb to this thing. Until a few months ago, the DC is Immune argument had more legs than the Frisco argument. DC is tax revenue fueled, DC is the Federal Government, for Gods sake. Frisco is a bunch of fuckin' homo's.
But DC is now falling. Hell, I would have bet DC suburbs would be far, FAR more immune than Frisco.
Watchword: This thing will be FAR WORSE than anyone thought possible.
>>I sorta doubt a lot of people here have lived in a "rust bucket" midwest town... or even visited.
I have.
The good thing about it is that Joe Momma and Big Daddy can buy a $110,000 house easily and not be in crazy debt.
The bad thing about it is that jobs have drained away, and that's no fun.
The midwest will be fine and fun once the population and jobs have balanced out. That'll just take time.
Also, Cedar Point is better than any amusement park in the west, especially if you love roller coasters.
The whole country is going to get hit hard. Bay Area hit hard, sure. People talk about diversification of employment in the Bay Area, but we know it's tech and the Internet that determine the housing prices, not all those other jobs. If tech loses its margins, Bay Area is absolutely screwed. It'll still be desirable, but it will be hung upside down and shaken hard and tons of people will leave.
Even magical Charlotte is showing some fear now with Wachovia and Bank of America trembling. Those giants are what anchors Charlotte's downtown.
this was a weak straw man effort.
By you? Me?
I'm not sure I understand who the "straw man" is in my argument.
I've presented some pretty concrete ideas here, recently & in past posts. The response has been "Not good enough".
That's OK. I CANNOT PROVE San Fran will go down hard. It's a hypothesis, hence UNPROVABLE.
But neither are shrieks of "straw man" and otherwise, PROOF that it won't. You've proven NOTHING, neither have I.
You say I have the Burden Of Proof. I have no such thing. Again, UNPROVABLE. Reality will out, as usual.
We will see.
The whole country is going to get hit hard. Bay Area hit hard, sure. People talk about diversification of employment in the Bay Area, but we know it's tech and the Internet that determine the housing prices, not all those other jobs. If tech loses its margins, Bay Area is absolutely screwed. It'll still be desirable, but it will be hung upside down and shaken hard and tons of people will leave.
Exactly. My hypothesis is that The Great De-Leveraging will bring The Great Affordability Leveling. Places that are "affordable" given local incomes, will just sorta bump along.
Places that have been historically very UNAFFORDABLE, like Frisco, DC, (2004-2006) Bend, and likewise, will get decimated. Home prices will revert to affordable bands.
$705K for a house in Frisco is affordable to about -75% of the population, +/- 50%. Strong employment? Great, even if that is TRUE, there ain't enough money to sustain $700K medians. The Great Deleveraging will bring that place into line, and it don't care about Quality of Life, Fag Parades, trolley cars and other useless shit.
CA medians DOWN 30+% in one year. That whole state is going down HARD.
"In other words, the study claims a house in Awbrey Butte appraised at $500,000 is really worth only $250,000."
Actually that's not what "49.5% overvalued" means. It means that a house really worth only $250,000 would be priced at $373,750, or 49.5% over value. So a house priced at $500,000 is really worth about 33% less, or $335,000.
Boy you're really fixated on this "SF is going down the toilet" idea. Nobody ever said the Bay Area is "immune" from the nationwide downtown. What people took issue with is your claim that SF is going to be Detroit.
"I don't give a fuck if Frisco & it's band of shrieking ass fags falls into the ocean."
This speaks volumes about why you're so passionately insisting that SF is doomed. A little homophobia, perhaps? Or "class envy"? Or a combination of both? Or are you doing a Jerry Falwell number on us -- "Them fags is doomed -- DOOMED by tha wrath o' GAWD, Ah tells ya!"
Nice work another great read.
Nobody ever said the Bay Area is 'immune' from the nationwide downtown. What people took issue with is your claim that SF is going to be Detroit.
Ditto. You're fighting at windmills, Don Quixote.
But if it meant living in a nice 3,000 sf home I paid $165K for, so I could use my excess cash to visit HI, or some other place I REALLY like ...
So you'd prefer to live in a shithole for 50 weeks a year so you could spend two weeks a year in a place you like. Yeah, THAT makes a lot of sense ...
Quality of life isn't everything; unless you have investments or some other outside source of income, you also need to be able to earn a living. But quality of life definitely is a factor when people choose where to live; that's why the Sunbelt has been growing for the past 30 years and the Rustbelt has been emptying out.
Median home price in California drops 30% in May. The figure falls to $339,000, the steepest monthly decline in at least two decades. That's drawing an influx of first-time buyers.
Do you understand what the last sentence means? It means the market is starting to correct itself, as it should. Of course the RE market in SF was overinflated (like RE markets pretty much everywhere) and a correction was necessary. But the correction is happening and equilibrium is being restored. The Bay Area is NOT going to turn into Detroit or Akron. Much as you and other obsessive California-haters may wish it.
>>"In other words, the study claims a house in Awbrey Butte appraised at $500,000 is really worth only $250,000."
Don't they teach percentages in school anymore?
Hey guys! I'm just about finished with my next invention! It's an environmentally friendly money laundering device with solar powered wings. Now the hard part...finding some fuckin' land to build these contraptions on.
Bye bitches!
Homer,
I tried to explain, your like dunc, you probably are dunc, just a vile version of that kiss-ass dunc.
I quite clearly said why I defended SF.
I'll say again, in my sixty years of RE biz, I have NEVER seen SF, nor in history even in the quake of 1900 did SF go down, that place has FUCKING spirit, people WANT to live there.
On the other hand there is BEND, an artificial desert ISL, held to life by the biggest CON-ARTISTS in the USA, BROOKS&CO ( man-twat/Metro-Sexual Corp USA ),
BEND is doomed, BEND is fucked, but SF is NOT.
That's my point homer, perhaps YOU being from the midwest KNOW nothing of SF, and I'm talking SF, I'm talking 5mi radius of GOLDEN-GATE park, just like when I TALK BEND, I'm talking ONE-MILE radius of Drake Park.
Your FUCKING siberian shit out in San-JOSE, is NOT fucking SF, nor is oakland, Shevlin is siberia, and so is east of hwy-I97.
Bend is NOT SF, SF will live on, and will always be the 'place', on the other hand BEND will cyclically go back to being a desert shit-hole for a long time, like it always does, until a new brood of fools are raised and fleeced.
Love, yours forever buster
Frisco is a bunch of fuckin' homo's.
*
I would rather have a home with a PHD, or HOMO artists anyday,
Over a BEND man-twat / Metro-Sexual blue-haired retired lizard on a road-bike.
SF has life, its the gay boyz are what make SF what it is, but the blue-haired get rich quick HELOC debt con-artists that RUN Bend ( brooks, bulletin, source, ... ) are just fucking what they are, ...
The gay boyz of SF have it all, ... the losers of Bend have nothing.
That's the point right there, SF has youth, and BEND is only about debt and death.
This last sentence is why SF will live and BEND will DIE.
You can see that at current prices, CACB has had a net gain of a buck or 2 over the last decade. Incredibly, MossCo, like a cancerous goiter, remains.
*
CACB is up more than the DJIA since January 2000.
Speaking of Paulina:
What that town really needs to do is get together and build a nice long paved runway for landing Citations and Gulfstreams. Then their town could grow. I'm sure their MILFs and youth would be happy to service the incoming wealthy folks and the kind people of Paulina wouldn't feel quite as inferior.
If they play their cards right, they might be able to lasso a Walmart out of the deal in a decade or so. Paulina, DON'T MAKE THE SAME MISTAKES THOSE DUMBASSES IN PAISLEY DID!!!!!
why the homophobia? irrationality destroys credibility.
Fuck you all and your homophobia name calling. I have some close gay friends but I don't have to think what they're doing is right. That's my opinion and if you don't like it, tough.
Head back to Cali/Berkeley if you want to be respected as a "Thought Policeman".
And....no one asked for your credibility vote anyway.
You guys have so missed the boat. The gay marriage industry is going to single-handedly save the Cali economy.
"Fuck you all and your homophobia name calling. I have some close gay friends but I don't have to think what they're doing is right."
You have to admit that Homer has never mentioned this issue before, but all of a sudden brings it up when he's trying find reasons to put down SF.
Personally, I think he's just trying to make things 'interesting' around here. And it's working -- look how many of us are writing in!
"A new study released by a national real estate analyst group finds that Bend’s housing market was the second most overvalued market in the U.S., behind only Atlantic City, New Jersey, out of 330 cities studied..."
Only Atlantic City is ahead of us out here in the High Desert. That's rich. And perhaps a prelude to further falls. I can't see any reason for not falling back to historical levels plus inflation. Just project the 1980-2002 graph forward and we see $180K or so medians.
Homer? He's old. The only gays he understands are the one's he personally knows. A lot like my father-in-law. The old ladies that have been together for 55 years that were the first married in Cali put most hetero's to shame when it comes to longevity of a relationship.
What people took issue with is your claim that SF is going to be Detroit.
WTF? I NEVER said that! I said I'd rather OWN something in Detroit than SF for the long haul.
SF turning into Detroit? Fuck, I ain't crazy. Yet.
So you'd prefer to live in a shithole for 50 weeks a year
As I said, lumping the entire midwest as a shithole... Valid in places... not others.
The only gays he understands are the one's he personally knows.
I have known, been friends with & even employed (Yes!) more homo's than you fags will ever see.
No one on Earth knows how to make fun of a bunch of fairies more hilariously than a flaming queer. Real hard core flamers ain't no closet Republican Larry Craiger: those fuckers are overtly & flamingly homo.
Lesbians? That's a different story. If I want to crush coal into diamonds, I need look no further than a couple of scowling lezbots. Yikes. Lighten up you ugly bitches.
Re: why the homophobia? irrationality destroys credibility.
Best comment of the day. Amazingly, a significant minority consider homophobia rational.
So how do we educate them?
>>So how do we educate them?
Make them watch gay porn movies.
Make them watch gay porn movies.
We have a new winner!
Best comment of the day.
Lesbians? That's a different story. If I want to crush coal into diamonds, I need look no further than a couple of scowling lezbots. Yikes. Lighten up you ugly bitches.
Yikes....I resemble this remark. I am taking an anon position here. Homer...How many couples in Bend have been in a 25+ year relationship, contributed to the community, always tried to advance the people they work for and with, taken in many that can't afford rent or food, volunteered for countless non profit events. The list is getting too long to keep puffing myself into some level of acceptance. Get off the gay tirade and come back to topic. If you need to be reminded it happens to be "Debating the Bend Oregon Real Estate bubble, its implications for Bend residents, businesses, and the economic outlook for this area".
Next week Homer's going to tell us that the earth is going to swallow up Las Vegas because . . . well, because the Lord doth smite those who condone gambling.
For a list of God's least favorite things:
http://stuffgodhates.wordpress.com/2008/04/18/8-anal/
Hey, renters, you're not necessarily second-class Americans after all! And you might even be patriots as well!
HOME NOT-SO-SWEET HOME
By PAUL KRUGMAN NY Times
“Owning a home lies at the heart of the American dream.” So declared President Bush in 2002, introducing his “Homeownership Challenge” — a set of policy initiatives that were supposed to sharply increase homeownership, especially for minority groups.
Oops. While homeownership rose as the housing bubble inflated, temporarily giving Mr. Bush something to boast about, it plunged — especially for African-Americans — when the bubble popped. Today, the percentage of American families owning their own homes is no higher than it was six years ago, and it’s a good bet that by the time Mr. Bush leaves the White House homeownership will be lower than it was when he moved in.
But here’s a question rarely asked, at least in Washington: Why should ever-increasing homeownership be a policy goal? How many people should own homes, anyway?
Listening to politicians, you’d think that every family should own its home — in fact, that you’re not a real American unless you’re a homeowner. “If you own something,” Mr. Bush once declared, “you have a vital stake in the future of our country.” Presumably, then, citizens who live in rented housing, and therefore lack that “vital stake,” can’t be properly patriotic. Bring back property qualifications for voting!
Even Democrats seem to share the sense that Americans who don’t own houses are second-class citizens. Early last year, just as the mortgage meltdown was beginning, Austan Goolsbee, a University of Chicago economist who is one of Barack Obama’s top advisers, warned against a crackdown on subprime lending. “For be it ever so humble,” he wrote, “there really is no place like home, even if it does come with a balloon payment mortgage.”
And the belief that you’re nothing if you don’t own a home is reflected in U.S. policy. Because the I.R.S. lets you deduct mortgage interest from your taxable income but doesn’t let you deduct rent, the federal tax system provides an enormous subsidy to owner-occupied housing. On top of that, government-sponsored enterprises — Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac and the Federal Home Loan Banks — provide cheap financing for home buyers; investors who want to provide rental housing are on their own.
In effect, U.S. policy is based on the premise that everyone should be a homeowner. But here’s the thing: There are some real disadvantages to homeownership.
First of all, there’s the financial risk. Although it’s rarely put it this way, borrowing to buy a home is like buying stocks on margin: if the market value of the house falls, the buyer can easily lose his or her entire stake.
This isn’t a hypothetical worry. From 2005 through 2007 alone — that is, at the peak of the housing bubble — more than 22 million Americans bought either new or existing houses. Now that the bubble has burst, many of those homebuyers have lost heavily on their investment. At this point there are probably around 10 million households with negative home equity — that is, with mortgages that exceed the value of their houses.
Owning a home also ties workers down. Even in the best of times, the costs and hassle of selling one home and buying another — one estimate put the average cost of a house move at more than $60,000 — tend to make workers reluctant to go where the jobs are.
And these are not the best of times. Right now, economic distress is concentrated in the states with the biggest housing busts: Florida and California have experienced much steeper rises in unemployment than the nation as a whole. Yet homeowners in these states are constrained from seeking opportunities elsewhere, because it’s very hard to sell their houses.
Finally, there’s the cost of commuting. Buying a home usually though not always means buying a single-family house in the suburbs, often a long way out, where land is cheap. In an age of $4 gas and concerns about climate change, that’s an increasingly problematic choice.
There are, of course, advantages to homeownership — and yes, my wife and I do own our home. But homeownership isn’t for everyone. In fact, given the way U.S. policy favors owning over renting, you can make a good case that America already has too many homeowners.
O.K., I know how some people will respond: anyone who questions the ideal of homeownership must want the population “confined to Soviet-style concrete-block high-rises” (as a Bloomberg columnist recently put it). Um, no. All I’m suggesting is that we drop the obsession with ownership, and try to level the playing field that, at the moment, is hugely tilted against renting.
And while we’re at it, let’s try to open our minds to the possibility that those who choose to rent rather than buy can still share in the American dream — and still have a stake in the nation’s future.
bruce said...
Re: why the homophobia? irrationality destroys credibility.
Best comment of the day. Amazingly, a significant minority consider homophobia rational.
So how do we educate them?
+++
Brucey-pussy?? Educate them??
Hmm... let's see...
.... educate us on your butt plug biz?
.... educate us on your mormonism?
.... educate us on your statutory rape beliefs?
.... educate us on your bike shop buff-as-can-be pro skier wife?
.... educate us on your Exec Session complaint?
Please, Brucey Pussy, do educate us all on everything!!
As a former Bay Area resident, I do want to stick up for SF and say that it will live on, but I also want it to crash and burn so that I can move back someday. One has to compare the Bay Area real estate situation to an onion. Right now, the outer few layers are being peeled off and discarded (these are the outlying areas 20-40 miles out that were overpriced farmland). The heart of the onion (SF) has not been significantly impacted to date. All of the severe price declines rest in sh!tholes like Brentwood and Antioch. In the next year or so, I think you'll see some significant pain in the actual City. Just watch and wait.
Restaurants go lean – but not with food
Downtown Bend establishments are adapting to economy as an uncertain summer arrives
By Jeff McDonald / The Bulletin
Published: June 23. 2008 4:00AM PST
Gavin McMichael, chef and owner of The Blacksmith Restaurant in Bend, says recent changes to the restaurant's look and menu have helped it during the economic slowdown. - Rob Kerr / The Bulletin
Rob Kerr / The Bulletin
Gavin McMichael, chef and owner of The Blacksmith Restaurant in Bend, says recent changes to the restaurant's look and menu have helped it during the economic slowdown.
Fighting slimmer revenues and profit margins caused by a combination of tighter consumer spending and skyrocketing food prices from suppliers, downtown Bend restaurateurs are hoping business picks up this summer and that high gas prices don’t hurt visitation in the year’s most important tourism season.
Adding to restaurants’ challenge: increasing competition and high lease rates.
At Volo, a casual, upscale restaurant in the 919 Bond building, business has improved each week since it opened six weeks ago, said owner Chris Jones. He added that summer will be critical for the restaurant, which opened after two years of planning.
“It’s a tough business,” he said. “It’s very competitive. I’m at the restaurant 16 hours a day. Everything’s expensive — the utilities, the lease, food and labor.”
The number of downtown restaurants for sale has increased in recent months, said Brode Mape, a business broker for Compass Commercial Real Estate Services in Bend.
There are about eight restaurant owners actively seeking offers and three owners who are willing to accept offers, Mape said. Despite the challenges that restaurant owners face, numerous people are interested in buying a restaurant, he said.
Typically, there are only about three restaurants for sale downtown, Mape said. He could not disclose which ones are available due to client confidentiality.
“It’s more than I’ve ever seen,” Mape said. “The economic climate is definitely impacting Bend across the board. The bulk of businesses are down.”
Lease rates signed in the last 24 to 36 months are making it tough for restaurant owners to make a profit because those leases generally are running between $2.25 per square foot and $2.50 per square foot or more per month, Mape said. The downtown rents are Bend’s highest, he said.
At Decoy Bar and Grill, which opened in December, monthly sales are off about $7,000 from early projections, said Jonathan Bohn, executive chef.
“Everyone had high hopes, but I’m a realist,” Bohn said. “I take what comes.”
Bohn has cut costs by keeping a lean staff, reducing waste in the kitchen and keeping an eye on prices, he said.
“There’s no waste, but quality remains the same,” he said.
It’s not a make-or-break summer for Decoy because the owners are able to finance the restaurant through lean times, Bohn said.
“You don’t open a restaurant without deep pockets,” he said.
Gavin McMichael, chef and owner of The Blacksmith Restaurant in Bend, said he saw the economic slowdown coming a year ago and remodeled his restaurant into what has essentially become two restaurants.
The bar and lounge portion of the restaurant offers more affordable dining options and smaller portions, McMichael said.
This summer, he will introduce New Q, upscale barbecue cooked on an outdoor grill and smoker, he said.
“Instead of doing a lot of New York steak, we’re doing flank steak,” he said.
Since reopening in December, the restaurant’s dining house customer counts have dropped on a per-seat basis, while the bar and lounge has done extremely well, McMichael said.
Increased competition has cut the revenue pie of all restaurants, industry representatives say. Downtown Bend now has 41 restaurants, excluding coffee and tea shops, according to the Bend Downtowners Association.
Some of downtown Bend’s restaurants may not survive through fall if business doesn’t pick up around town this summer, McMichael predicted.
Summer accounts for half the revenue of Central Oregon’s estimated $570.7 million-a-year tourism industry, according to the Central Oregon Visitors Association.
The question this summer: How will high gas prices affect tourism? With lingering uneasiness about the economy and airfares soaring because of skyrocketing jet fuel, some tourism representatives are speculating that more people may vacation closer to home rather than fly somewhere farther away. That could bode well for locations like Central Oregon that are relatively close to key population centers such as the Willamette Valley and Portland.
“They’ve been talking about (people traveling closer to home), but what we really need is a population explosion in the summertime for it to make sense (for restaurants to succeed),” McMichael said. “We need more heads, but with the $100 drive over from Portland, I don’t know how some (restaurants) will do it.”
Central Oregon’s tourism industry will play a key role in how Bend’s restaurants do, said Bill Perry, vice president of governmental affairs for the Oregon Restaurant Association, based in Wilsonville.
Central Oregon could benefit from in-state travelers who are budgeting their vacations and not traveling as far, Perry said.
“The question is: Will the family go to the coast or Bend, instead of Hawaii or Disneyland?” Perry said. “We don’t know the answer right now. As the tourism community, we’re hopeful that people will decide to travel in Oregon instead of not taking vacations at all.”
Jeff McDonald can be reached at 383-0323 or at jmcdonald@bendbulletin.com.
Some of downtown Bend’s restaurants may not survive through fall if business doesn’t pick up around town this summer, McMichael predicted.
Summer accounts for half the revenue of Central Oregon’s estimated $570.7 million-a-year tourism industry, according to the Central Oregon Visitors Association.
Standard Bulletin bullshit: In one breath, revenue is down hard in one of the biggest sectors of the tourist industry, in the next, by God, they quote that 100% bullshit, EVER-INCREASING $570.7 million fantasy.
Nice.
As I've been saying... I have heard the downtown restaurant industry is going to implode.
They're sugar coating it here as usual, but the fact that a story like this even made print, tells you it's DAMN BAD.
At Volo, a casual, upscale restaurant in the 919 Bond building, business has improved each week since it opened six weeks ago, said owner Chris Jones. He added that summer will be critical for the restaurant, which opened after two years of planning.
Wow, you don't say? Six straight weeks of improvement? Damn. That's pretty good. Was it:
$0
$1
$2
$3
....
>>a story like this even made print, tells you it's DAMN BAD.
If there ever was a lagging indicator in this town...having the Bulletin do a "it's not so bad" story has got to fuckin be it.
This summer, he will introduce New Q, upscale barbecue cooked on an outdoor grill and smoker, he said.
Hope springs eternal for these crazy bastards.
Just like a Bend builder: Response to a crushing slowdown? BUILD MORE.
“The question is: Will the family go to the coast or Bend, instead of Hawaii or Disneyland?” Perry said.
False dichotomy.
Yup, there are MILLIONS of Americans contemplating one of ONLY TWO CHOICES to spend their TRILLIONS:
Bend & Oregon Coast
vs
DISNEYLAND & Hawaii
Woof. How deluded are these dumbfucks?
“They’ve been talking about (people traveling closer to home), but what we really need is a population explosion in the summertime for it to make sense (for restaurants to succeed),” McMichael said. “We need more heads, but with the $100 drive over from Portland, I don’t know how some (restaurants) will do it.”
Of course, there's the rub. High gas prices are murderous on the Cent OR economy. NO ONE is going to drive 150... 250... 500 miles down a dead end street to get to a dying town. The longer gas prices stay where they are, the less chance this place will EVER recover.
High gas prices are probably the single biggest drag LONG TERM on this places economy. Lower housing might have brought 'em back... but they won't make the drive when it cost $300.
Bend is where you go skiing, it's not where you take the kids. You take the kids somewhere where there's something to do.
Home Not-So-Sweet Home
By PAUL KRUGMAN
Published: June 23, 2008
“Owning a home lies at the heart of the American dream.” So declared President Bush in 2002, introducing his “Homeownership Challenge” — a set of policy initiatives that were supposed to sharply increase homeownership, especially for minority groups.
Oops. While homeownership rose as the housing bubble inflated, temporarily giving Mr. Bush something to boast about, it plunged — especially for African-Americans — when the bubble popped. Today, the percentage of American families owning their own homes is no higher than it was six years ago, and it’s a good bet that by the time Mr. Bush leaves the White House homeownership will be lower than it was when he moved in.
But here’s a question rarely asked, at least in Washington: Why should ever-increasing homeownership be a policy goal? How many people should own homes, anyway?
Listening to politicians, you’d think that every family should own its home — in fact, that you’re not a real American unless you’re a homeowner. “If you own something,” Mr. Bush once declared, “you have a vital stake in the future of our country.” Presumably, then, citizens who live in rented housing, and therefore lack that “vital stake,” can’t be properly patriotic. Bring back property qualifications for voting!
Even Democrats seem to share the sense that Americans who don’t own houses are second-class citizens. Early last year, just as the mortgage meltdown was beginning, Austan Goolsbee, a University of Chicago economist who is one of Barack Obama’s top advisers, warned against a crackdown on subprime lending. “For be it ever so humble,” he wrote, “there really is no place like home, even if it does come with a balloon payment mortgage.”
And the belief that you’re nothing if you don’t own a home is reflected in U.S. policy. Because the I.R.S. lets you deduct mortgage interest from your taxable income but doesn’t let you deduct rent, the federal tax system provides an enormous subsidy to owner-occupied housing. On top of that, government-sponsored enterprises — Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac and the Federal Home Loan Banks — provide cheap financing for home buyers; investors who want to provide rental housing are on their own.
In effect, U.S. policy is based on the premise that everyone should be a homeowner. But here’s the thing: There are some real disadvantages to homeownership.
First of all, there’s the financial risk. Although it’s rarely put this way, borrowing to buy a home is like buying stocks on margin: if the market value of the house falls, the buyer can easily lose his or her entire stake.
This isn’t a hypothetical worry. From 2005 through 2007 alone — that is, at the peak of the housing bubble — more than 22 million Americans bought either new or existing houses. Now that the bubble has burst, many of those homebuyers have lost heavily on their investment. At this point there are probably around 10 million households with negative home equity — that is, with mortgages that exceed the value of their houses.
Owning a home also ties workers down. Even in the best of times, the costs and hassle of selling one home and buying another — one estimate put the average cost of a house move at more than $60,000 — tend to make workers reluctant to go where the jobs are.
And these are not the best of times. Right now, economic distress is concentrated in the states with the biggest housing busts: Florida and California have experienced much steeper rises in unemployment than the nation as a whole. Yet homeowners in these states are constrained from seeking opportunities elsewhere, because it’s very hard to sell their houses.
Finally, there’s the cost of commuting. Buying a home usually though not always means buying a single-family house in the suburbs, often a long way out, where land is cheap. In an age of $4 gas and concerns about climate change, that’s an increasingly problematic choice.
There are, of course, advantages to homeownership — and yes, my wife and I do own our home. But homeownership isn’t for everyone. In fact, given the way U.S. policy favors owning over renting, you can make a good case that America already has too many homeowners.
O.K., I know how some people will respond: anyone who questions the ideal of homeownership must want the population “confined to Soviet-style concrete-block high-rises” (as a Bloomberg columnist recently put it). Um, no. All I’m suggesting is that we drop the obsession with ownership, and try to level the playing field that, at the moment, is hugely tilted against renting.
And while we’re at it, let’s try to open our minds to the possibility that those who choose to rent rather than buy can still share in the American dream — and still have a stake in the nation’s future.
Some of downtown Bend’s restaurants may not survive through fall if business doesn’t pick up around town this summer, McMichael predicted.
My wife and I were downtown on Saturday for the "Bite of Bend" (a waste of time) and, sweet Jaysus, there seemed to be three or four restaurants on every block. No way in HELL this town can support even half that many even in good times. My guess is 60-70% of them will go under within a year.
Bend is where you go skiing, it's not where you take the kids. You take the kids somewhere where there's something to do.
I guess you've never been to Sunriver in the summertime, then. Swarming with kids, Timmy.
My guess is 60-70% of them will go under within a year.
Ditto. Too bad too. I eat downtown a lot, and my guess is that the lack of choice will drive downtown workers out of the core to find eats...
I already feel like I've eaten in every downtown restaurant 500X.
Owning a home also ties workers down. Even in the best of times, the costs and hassle of selling one home and buying another — one estimate put the average cost of a house move at more than $60,000 — tend to make workers reluctant to go where the jobs are.
And these are not the best of times. Right now, economic distress is concentrated in the states with the biggest housing busts: Florida and California have experienced much steeper rises in unemployment than the nation as a whole. Yet homeowners in these states are constrained from seeking opportunities elsewhere, because it’s very hard to sell their houses.
This is an excellent point. It's the TRANSACTION COSTS that have exploded in the past 2 years. Getting from one "state" (ie job... or whatever) to another has skyrocketed. Dead RE market & high gas prices have poured cold molasses on the gears of America's economy.
And it's not going away. You'll need to convince over a billion Chinese & Indians NOT to consume their way to a prosperity 1/10th as good as ours. Not gonna happen.
Bend is where you go skiing, it's not where you take the kids. You take the kids somewhere where there's something to do.
Have you ever gone down to the river and amused yourself by watching the folks rafting through Big Eddy? Most of them are families with kids.
Have you ever gone to Tumalo State Park during the summer? No vacancy. Filled with families.
So,maybe you're just one of those Bendites who lives here but doesn't do anything outdoors?!
The percentage of Americans willing to drive a long time to do something outside is pretty small. Americans are fat.
Sunriver swarming with kids? Compared to, say, DisneyWorld or SeaWorld? I guess my east coast sense of scale is causing me to see these "swarms" as pretty small. Yeah, I've seen the "hordes" of these outdoor Americans. We're supposed to build an economy out of that?
My kids do outdoor stuff. But if I took them on a vacation that was _just_ outdoor stuff, hmm. What percentage of people in America is that?
We're supposed to build an economy out of that?
*
We already have. Bend has a large number of outfitters and guide services.
Bend has a large number of outfitters and guide services.
"Large number"? How many -- two dozen? (I found 12 listings in the Yellow Pages under "Guides" and another 12 under "Rafts.") How many people does this mighty "industry" employ locally? A hundred? Two hundred? And how many of them make anything close to a living wage?
Sorry, this is not a solid foundation for an economy. For Maupin, maybe, but not for a city of more than 75,000.
"The percentage of Americans willing to drive a long time to do something outside is pretty small."
And there are a lot of places they can go to do it besides Bend. A lot of people around here seem to think this is the only place in the world where you can fish, ride a mountain bike and climb rocks. Tain't so, folks.
Printed in WSJ today:
The last resort
By Antony Currie
Bank bailouts: The Federal Reserve’s decision to take on $29bn of Bear Stearns’ assets may soon look like chicken feed. If problems at US banks worsen, the government – in other words, taxpayers – is likely to be on the hook for sorting out much of the mess.
It’s not that the collapse of any one, or even a few, of the thousands of mostly small and mid-sized retail and commercial banks across America would pose the same kind of threat to the financial system that the now-defunct investment bank did. And anyway, most have access to the Fed for emergency funding.
The problem is that the other usual escape routes available to struggling Main Street banks are narrowing. It’s getting harder to tap either new or existing shareholders for new funds to replenish bank capital. That’s because virtually all the deals that have been struck in the last few months – whether common stock or convertible bonds – have performed poorly. Those who bought stakes in Citigroup, Merrill Lynch, Wachovia, Washington Mutual and Keycorp, for example, are all underwater.
Investors have tired of trying to call a bottom on bank losses. That’s making them much less willing to take on more exposure. Bankers reckon it would now be tough to complete the deals they squared away as recently as a couple of weeks ago. It’s a similar story across the Atlantic, where British lenders Bradford & Bingley and HBOS are both trying to get big rights issues away with their share prices sagging and investors already loaded up with paper sold by the likes of UBS and the Royal Bank of Scotland.
The mere whiff of a shortage of capital is now enough to send shareholders scampering for the exits. Citigroup’s stock, for example, fell more than 5% late last week after finance chief Gary Crittenden told investors the firm would probably take more write-downs on mortgage-related assets – hardly a surprise.
At least Citigroup and other big banks have size and brand recognition in their favour, making them better placed to attract more cash than their smaller brethren. But access to capital isn’t the only issue for smaller banks. In the past, a troubled lender could always try to sell.
That’s never easy in a downturn when potential acquirers’ executives are reluctant to take on potentially still risky assets they aren’t familiar with. This time around, it’s even harder. For starters, so far only residential mortgages have caused much pain beyond Wall Street. Other consumer loans like car and credit card debt are only beginning to suffer, as are commercial mortgages. Losses here could keep the credit crisis rolling for another year or more.
What’s more, unlike investment banks, retail and commercial banks usually book loans and other assets at face value until actual defaults appear likely. But under purchase accounting rules introduced earlier this decade, a takeover target’s portfolio has to be marked to the current market value when it is acquired.
That could crystallise substantial losses, a factor that is staying the hands of the few potential acquirers. Bankers say it’s the reason a rumored bid for National City failed to materialise. It’s no wonder bank M&A volume is already 80% down on last year, according to Goldman Sachs.
There’s often only one option left for a capital-starved US bank that can’t attract a suitor – receivership under the auspices of the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation. While hardly ideal, that works fine as long as only a few banks stumble. But if the pressures of the credit crunch cause too many to fail, FDIC could be overwhelmed. True, the government could prop it up, but that simply passes on the risk to the taxpayer. No wonder Sheila Bair, FDIC’s chairwoman, has said bank problems are giving her heartburn.
Is this CACB's future?
How many people does this mighty "industry" employ locally? A hundred? Two hundred?
*
Dude, unless yer blind you'll see way more than 200 people are employed in the outdoor industry in Central Oregon. Nobody said it's the foundation of the local economy, but it does employ many people on a seasonal basis.
WTF? I NEVER said that! I said I'd rather OWN something in Detroit than SF for the long haul.
*
That in itself is DUMB FUCK talk. Ok, homer go fucking do it, right now you can buy in anything in Detroit for $15k.
But a nice shit-shack near Golden-Gate park will run a you a million.
In detroit you will die, at golden-gate park you'll get stoned at worst, and laid at best.
FUCK YOU homer, your full of shit.
Go buy your fucking detroit mansion, and quit talking shit.
“The question is: Will the family go to the coast or Bend, instead of Hawaii or Disneyland?” Perry said.
Timmy says no-way will a family choose Bend. I say yes-way. And they don't just come here to camp and fish and raft and bike and hike and float and canoe and sailboard. They also come here to shop and get sauna treatments and and eat at fine restaurants and go to outdoor concerts. Have you ever been in the Ameritel on a summer weekend, Timmy?!
For the same amount of money it costs a family to fly to Disneyland or Hawaii for a three-day vacation, a family in the northwest can drive to Bend and spend two weeks here. No matter how fat they are!
>>Have you ever gone to Tumalo State Park during the summer? No vacancy. Filled with families.
Holy shit...have you ever BEEN to Tumalo State park when it was no vacancy? Try it...just once go spend the afternoon there. Then report back and we'll talk if you are taking your family next time. We'll also discuss Tim's view that Americans are fat. And why on earth would she be wearing a thong? And where the hell does all of this white trash come from?
Dude, unless yer blind you'll see way more than 200 people are employed in the outdoor industry in Central Oregon.
The other poster (or was it you?) referred specifically to "guides and outfitters." Now you're talking about a much broader category. But most of those are still crap jobs, not something you can base an economy on.
For the same amount of money it costs a family to fly to Disneyland or Hawaii for a three-day vacation, a family in the northwest can drive to Bend and spend two weeks here.
Which begs the question: What would they do after the first four days?
But then again: We have friends from California who like to come to Sunriver for vacation because, they say, there's nothing to do. Boredom is a nice change of pace, they say.
>>Which begs the question: What would they do after the first four days?
After two days they are sunburnt and watching cable. The kids want to go home.
Has anyone heard how sunriver is doing? I know the busy season is about to start and it may be to early to get percentages. Then again the extra vacation money may have to go to buy food gas ect.., And I heard the credit card companys are starting to crack down on the money they loan out.
Banks Trimming Limits for Many on Credit Cards
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By ERIC DASH
Published: June 21, 2008
The easy money that led Americans to depend on credit cards to pay their bills is starting to dry up.
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Multimedia
Graphic
Less Money to Borrow After fostering the explosive growth of consumer debt in recent years, financial companies are reducing the credit limits on cards held by millions of Americans, often without warning.
Banks that issue cards like Visa and MasterCard, as well as the American Express Company, are cutting the limits for customers who have run up big debts, live in areas that have been hit hard by the housing crisis or work for themselves in troubled industries.
The reductions come as consumers, squeezed by a slack economy, a weak housing market and rising unemployment, are falling behind on monthly credit card payments in growing numbers.
Credit card lenders are also culling their accounts ahead of new rules that are intended to benefit consumers but could limit the profits on customers deemed bigger risks.
Many Americans have come to rely on credit cards to cover everyday expenses like groceries, gasoline and medical bills, in addition to big-ticket items and luxuries. While consumer spending, the nation’s economic engine, has been surprisingly resilient of late, a more sweeping reduction in credit card limits could pose serious challenges for hard-pressed consumers and, in turn, the broader economy.
Many are already feeling pinched. Pamela Pfitzer, a family therapist with a stable six-figure income, was stunned when she went to a garden center near her home outside Sacramento in early April and tried to buy about $30 worth of flowers with her American Express card. Her transaction was denied, she says, even though she insists she had rarely missed a payment and had just made one for $1,000.
After inadvertently hitting her credit limit a few months ago and then falling behind on a mortgage payment, Ms. Pfitzer said her limit was lowered by American Express to $900 from $2,300. The flowers pushed her over the new cap.
Then last month it happened again, she says, when she tried to buy office furniture with her Wells Fargo Visa card. Although she had just made a payment of about $700, Ms. Pfitzer found out that her credit limit had been lowered to $2,000 from $2,800.
“In all the years I have had credit cards, I have never had this happen before,” Ms. Pfitzer said. “Now it has happened twice in the last few months.”
Banks and mortgage companies are required by law to notify customers within three days of changing the limits on a home equity line of credit, and many have been aggressively lowering them. But credit card lenders have 30 days to notify their customers, and often do so only after taking action.
Such moves can cause a consumer’s credit score to drop, forcing the person to pay higher interest rates and making it harder to obtain new loans.
Even so, disclaimers in the fine print of credit card applications typically stipulate that the issuer can cancel or alter credit limits at any time, regardless of a customer’s payment or credit history.
Washington Mutual cut back the total credit lines available to its cardholders by nearly 10 percent in the first quarter of the year, according to an analysis of bank regulatory data. HSBC Holdings, Target and Wells Fargo each trimmed their credit card lines by about 3 percent.
Among those four lenders, that amounts to a reduction of about $15 billion in three months. Over all, the amount of available credit for the industry appears to be about flat, with the three biggest issuers — Bank of America, JPMorgan Chase and Citigroup — slightly increasing their overall credit lines. But even they are trying to rein in risky individual accounts.
Big banks face intense pressure on their balance sheets as they bring on billions of dollars worth of complex mortgage-related investments and other loans they are struggling to sell. Meanwhile, they are bracing for a surge in credit card losses as the job market and economy falter.
Consumers are reaching deeper into their pockets to pay for groceries and gas. Last year, as many as half of all those who took out home equity loans used the money to help pay down their credit card debt, according to J. D. Power research. But home equity is no longer an easy source of financing. Month after month, cardholders keep falling behind on their bills.
“This downturn is the perfect storm where the consumer is getting squeezed from all levels,” said Michael Taiano, a credit card industry analyst at Sandler O’Neill. He projects that credit card loss rates for lenders, now around 5.7 percent, could go as high as 10 percent in next 18 months. That would be higher than the peak levels reached after the 2001 technology bust.
S&P 500
Here is a fun game. Goto the above chart and see if you can see the tech bubble. Next see if you can tell the housing bubble. Then decide if we've hit bottom yet.
Timothy said...
My kids do outdoor stuff. But if I took them on a vacation that was _just_ outdoor stuff, hmm. What percentage of people in America is that?
More than you may think.
Do your kids a favor and yank them away from the cable and Wii, Timmy. Buy them some sunscreen and take them rafting; they'll forget about Splash Mountain.
Take them biking on the whoop-de-doos at Phil's Trail, even if you gotta put them in the Burley. They won't care about Cedar Point anymore.
Create some REAL memories for your kids, Timmy. Teach them that they don't need the commercial hype to have fun in life. If YOU don't, who will?
Then take the money you save your family by vacationing locally, and get rid of that rattle trap you're driving, Timmy. There now, you've just given your kids a valuable economics lesson.
Teach your children well...
They've never been to Cedar Point. That's where I want to go! :-)
This is the delusion of Bend. A bunch of outdoorsy types who assume everyone else is like them. If that were true we wouldn't have over a thousand houses on the market. There'd be a million people here.
>>Which begs the question: What would they do after the first four days?
After two days they are sunburnt and watching cable. The kids want to go home.
Talk about lack of imagination! Here are a few things to do outdoors in Central Oregon during the summer.
Riding the lifts and hike at Mt. Bachelor
Rafting/tubing/kayaking down Deschutes River
Canoeing on one of the Cascade Lakes
Camping
Spelunking at Lava River Cave
Geology tour of Lava Butte, Fort Rock, Crack in the Ground
Parks: Shevlin, Harmon, Drake, Tumalo, Cline Falls
Swimming at Juniper or Sunriver
Horseback riding at Sunriver or Seventh Mountain
Scenic flights above Cascades, Crater Lake
Rock hunting at Richardson's Rock Ranch and Glass Butte
Rock climbing at Smith Rock
Mountain climbing on South Sister
Mountain biking at Phil's trail system
Road bike riding
Boating, fishing, hiking at Newberry Crater
Hiking river trail along Deschutes
Fishing on river
Golfing
Summer Sunday concert at Les Schwab amphitheater
Farmers market (Wednesday PM)
Munch and Music (Thursday PM)
Munch and Movie (Friday PM)
High Desert Museum
Pine Mountain observatory
America's fat kids are tired after a half hour. They can maybe do two of the things on that list as they huff and puff and whine.
See how hard you have to try to be convincing?
They want to go to DisneyWorld and eat junk food.
I guess we'll just have to wait and see if people really drive out here in large numbers. I'm skeptical.
Sure, you'll get the usual crowd of athletic, health-conscious people. I don't see that as a growth opportunity.
Sounds like you people just want the kids to get off their asses. That's a great idea, but it's like trying to sell kids a new brand of brighter-green spinach. Good luck.
Timothy said...
This is the delusion of Bend. A bunch of outdoorsy types who assume everyone else is like them. If that were true we wouldn't have over a thousand houses on the market. There'd be a million people here.
I dare say you are equally delusional if you think a family would not choose Bend as a vacation destination. And you are certainly delusional if you think the dramatic increase in our town's population has nothing to do with the opportunities for outdoor recreation here.
And I can guarantee you that REI was not delusional when they chose to open one of their largest stores here.
Sally Jewell, CEO of REI Equipment Inc: "Bend is small, but it is full of people who share a passion for the outdoors. Bend is the gateway community to the outdoors. It doesn't matter what age they are, people are active in Bend. Bend's recreation index is off the charts. This is truly a destination area for outdoor recreation and a shopping hub for Central Oregon."
Bend measures 170 on a recreational index, far higher than the U.S. average of 100. That index is a measure of how people spend their free time participating in non-team sports like cycling, camping, biking and skiing.
Sure, Bend is not the only place in the world where you can "fish, ride a mountain bike and climb rocks", and that's why there AREN'T a million people here, Timmy.
Yet.
And no, I'm not a kool-aid drinker. But I usually have a batch of kool-aid popsicles in the freezer for my kids. Maybe you should go make your kids a batch, Timmy...they're just as good as the Dippin' Dots at Cedar Point.
Orvis is scheduled to open a store in Old Mill later this year too. I don't think they are delusional about the number of outdoorsy types in Bend either. I'm sure they've done their marketing homework as well.
And before you vent frustration that I post Anonymous-ly... I do so because Mr. Doh, in one of his blogger rages, told me to "get the fuck out" because I disagreed with his logic on one point. Not a very civil way to treat a lady. But then, how could he have known?
It was I, not Dunc, who stirred up the pot a bit by questioning whether or not Marge is a woman :-)
Hey Marge, Hank Jr wanted me to post up his lastest edition of this old favorite just for you.
:)
The preacher man says it’s the end of time
And the Mississippi River she’s a goin’ dry
The interest is up and the Stock Markets down
And you only get mugged
If you go down town
I live back in the woods, you see
A woman and the kids, and the dogs and me
I got a shotgun rifle and a 4-wheel drive
And a country girl can survive
Country folks can survive
I can plow a field all day long
I can catch catfish from dusk till dawn
We make our own whiskey and our own smoke too
Ain’t too many things these ole girls can’t do
We grow good ole tomatoes and homemade wine
And a country girl can survive
Country folks can survive
Because you can’t starve us out
And you cant makes us run
Cause one-of- ‘em old boys raisin ole shotgun
And we say grace and we say Ma’am
And if you ain’t into that we don’t give a damn
We came from the West Virginia coalmines
And the Rocky Mountains and the and the western skies
And we can skin a buck; we can run a trot-line
And a country girl can survive
Country folks can survive
I had a good friend in New York City
He never called me by my name, just hillbilly
My grandpa taught me how to live off the land
And his taught him to be a businessman
He used to send me pictures of the Broadway nights
And I’d send him some homemade wine
But he was killed by a man with a switchblade knife
For 43 dollars my friend lost his life
Id love to spit some beechnut in that dudes eyes
And shoot him with my old 45
Cause a country girl can survive
Country folks can survive
Cause you can’t starve us out and you can’t make us run
Cause one-of- ‘em old boys raisin ole shotgun
And we say grace and we say Ma’am
And if you ain’t into that we don’t give a damn
We’re from North California and south Alabam
And little towns all around this land
And we can skin a buck; we can run a trot-line
And a country girl can survive
Country folks can survive
>> Orvis is scheduled to open a store in Old Mill later this year too. I don't think they are delusional about the number of outdoorsy types in Bend either. I'm sure they've done their marketing homework as well.
Orvis and REI are one in the same. They know there are a bunch of monied wannabe outdoorsy types who buy shit that sits in their garage. Mainly bought with Dad & Mom's dough. Well, REI moreso than Orvis. Orvis makes good stuff but is a little fuddy duddy when it comes to the "Bend Lifestyle".
Seriously, would you want to buy your flies from a local flyshop or an overpriced chain?
I'll grant that Bend is an attractive tourist destination. Living here, it's hard to imagine someone packing up the car to come here just to hang out at Munchin Music.
But we definitely don't want to center our economy around seasonal tourism. It's a heartbreaker.
I just returned from Spokane, land of "toy condos" for your boat etc. for $70K. Spokane looks a lot like Bend, but there are more places to work, and colleges. On top of that, housing is much cheaper.
Can someone tell me why Bend is "special" compared to Spokane?
Today's kids play video games, rather than riding bikes. Bend's "recreation index" of 170, whatever that is, tells me that if there were 100,000 people in Bend, the market for recreational stuff would resemble a city of 170,000. All fine and well, but what does the rent reflect, 100 or 170?
spokane is the poor white trash capital of the northwest a lot of crime as well. One thing spokane has thats like bend is a lot of transplants from cali.
"I just returned from Spokane"
I'd agree that Spokane isn't that great. All of eastern Washington feels like you're in the furthest corner of the earth. Not a place people would go unless they're born there. Or manage to get a job there. Or just want to get away from it all.
I live back in the woods, you see
A woman and the kids, and the dogs and me
I got a shotgun rifle and a 4-wheel drive
Can you make your own gasoline too, hillbilly?
anon 9:16: Yes, that's all fine. But there's none of that stuff you can't do in a thousand other places.
Create some REAL memories for your kids, Timmy. Teach them that they don't need the commercial hype to have fun in life. If YOU don't, who will?
What I find off-putting about many of the Bend outdoorsy types is their aura of smug moral superiority, as if their chosen "lifestyle" is the only right one for a human being. The preceding quote fairly reeks of it.
Not everybody likes to spend every waking moment biking, hiking, skiing, snowboarding and rock climbing. (In fact I would think a life spent that way would be incredibly boring for any intelligent human being above the age of 10 or 11.) Some of us prefer other pursuits. This is not a matter of morality or virtue, just a matter of personal taste.
And if you think the outdoor recreation industry isn't also riddled with "commercial hype," you must live in a cave.
Orvis and REI are one in the same. They know there are a bunch of monied wannabe outdoorsy types who buy shit that sits in their garage.
Yup. Orvis also sells a lot of clothes and other stuff that has nothing to do with outdoor rec.
Seriously, would you want to buy your flies from a local flyshop or an overpriced chain?
I tie my own, thanks.
>> I tie my own, thanks.
Ah yes....something I ain't got around to doing yet. Props to ya.
Bend parking complaint leads to raid, 3 arrests
Posted: June 24, 2008 05:15 PM PDT
Brent Kay Redd Sr., Jimmy Kevin McClintick, Donald Lavern Parsons (Deschutes County Jail photos)
Stolen go-kart frame, meth found
From KTVZ.COM news sources
Bend police responding to a parking complaint in the Old Town district spotted a stolen go-kart frame and later conducted a raid that also turned up methamphetamine and led to three arrests.
Officers responded around 8:30 a.m. Monday to a call of a parking complaint in the 600 block of Northwest Georgia Avenue, said Sgt. Clint Burleigh.
During the investigation, one officer recognize a go-kart frame and wiring harness inside a shed next to 615 ½ NW Georgia. The items were reported being stolen about a week earlier from the Toy Zone, a store at 923 SE Third St. that sells go-karts, dune buggies, scooters and other vehicles, Burleigh said.
Officers identified residents Jimmy McClintick and Brent Kay Redd Sr., both 46, as suspects in the theft, Burleigh said.
A search warrant was executed at the Georgia Avenue address around 1:30 p.m. Monday, recovering the stolen item and user amounts of meth and meth paraphernalia, Burleigh said.
Redd Sr. and McClintick were lodged at the Deschutes County Jail on charges of first-degree theft, conspiracy to commit theft and meth possession. Redd was held on $50,000 bail and McClintick on $30,000 bail.
A third resident, Donald Parsons, 52, was contacted during the raid and later arrested for meth possession.
Go to ktvz.com and you get to see their pictures real wingdingers
quimby,
Mostly I tie my own also or buy some of the tiny ones from Peter at Patient Angler. There are no glasses strong enough for my 50+ year old eyes to tie 20+. Yeah, yeah, mag/lite:(
Ya ought to try it.
St.Paddy
I am impressed! It seems to be my song. Thanks. I would only change a few words.
We’re (I'm)from North(So) California and south Alabam (Minnesota)
And little towns all around this land
And we(I) can skin a buck; we (I) can run a trot-line
And a country boy(gal) can survive
Country folks can (will) survive.
My rendition: Saturday as a fact:
Went out to the range on the eastside of Bend
just to see if I can still hit the back side of them
The 9 mil shot good til it didn't jack a round
and it always makes such a thunderous sound
Sure made big holes in all that I hit
Made me think that I was a good with it
My Ole 22 Baretta was a sure shot that day
as it's light as a feather and no one knows it's away
The garden is planted and the critters are mad
I finally blocked the hole in the fence that I had
The spuds are coming up
and the radi's not far behind
if we could grow wheat
I would grind
Bend is as safe as any town
just make sure that you look around
Costco, Drake Park or downtown
the muggers all around
Never keep more than half a tank of gas
or it will belong
to a thief named Frank and he’ll be long gone
If we could all go back in time
we may have thought of the last thin dime
Too late now as we move to a new time
where we are all bent towards crime
As time goes on we all get along
sit round a fire singing a song
As time goes on we all get along
sit round a fire singing a song
Luv ya all...Peace
If ya all put the above to the tempo of The Night The Lights Went Out In Georgia by Reba McEntire that is how it sounded to me.
So did ya see the Principal Broker of Southebeees had a NOD ? loto money...$2,890,000+ OUCH
2008-026932 IMAGE DOC TYPE: Notice of Default & Election to Sell DATE REC: 6/23/2008 3:54:17 PM
REFERENCES: 2006-025752
DIRECT: SINNOTT, JEANNE KALLAGE TRUSTEE INDIRECT: YEAKEL, GREGORY R
SUBDIVISION: WILLIAMSON PARK 6TH ADDITION LOT: 3
Reba? I had no idea. I just remember Vicki Lawrence doing it.
My kids do all that Smith Rock, river swimming, summer camps stuff. They do sports.
I'm not saying do get out and don't be healthy.
I;m just saying I don't think the outdoorsy thing _as a vacation_ appeals to a whole hell of a lot of people. Some, sure.
Like I said, we'll see.
Like I said, we'll see.
*
See here:
Active Outdoor Recreation Generates Economic Growth
Boulder, CO, April 17th, 2007 — The Outdoor Industry Association (OIA) today announced the availability of a report by Outdoor Industry Foundation that details the enormous impact of outdoor recreation on the economies of twenty-one states.
According to a national report, released in August 2006, active outdoor recreation contributes a total of $730 billion annually, supporting 6.5 million jobs (1 in 20 U.S. jobs), generating $88 billion in federal and state tax revenue and stimulating 8% of all consumer spending. This outdoor recreation economy is fueled by the more than three-quarters of Americans who participate in bicycling, camping, fishing, hunting, paddling, hiking, snow sports, and wildlife viewing activities.
"REI has one of their largest stores in Bend"
Been in that store 50 times to kill time while my wife shops at other stores. I hardly ever make a purchase there but always check the register as I go out the door.
I have never seen more than two people in line. Ever. The Bend store is just one big billboard for the entire chain. Talked to the neighbor kid who works there. His description; fucking tomb.
I;m just saying I don't think the outdoorsy thing _as a vacation_ appeals to a whole hell of a lot of people.
apparently you've never been camping?
people camp for vacations, I know it sounds crazy but it's true.
no lawns to manicure when you're camping though.
I;m just saying I don't think the outdoorsy thing _as a vacation_ appeals to a whole hell of a lot of people.
>>apparently you've never been camping?
people camp for vacations, I know it sounds crazy but it's true.<<
It's not crazy, and it's true, and we are talking a whole hell of a lot of people.
The following data show the trends in outdoor recreation activites for East/Central Oregon (Keep in mind this shows Number Change and Percent Change, not total numbers :
1987 - 2002 User Visits
Outdoor Growth Activities:
RV/Trailer Camping 1,132,740 96%
Fishing From a Boat 704,639 190%
Big Game Hunting 541,058 880%
Wildlife Observation 1,426,889 161%
Hunting 214,257 313%
ATV Riding 142,719 455%
Golf 616,793 173%
Timothy said...
My kids do all that Smith Rock, river swimming, summer camps stuff.
Then surely you are aware of the popularity of Smith Rock as an international rock climbing destination. There are numerous guide outfits in this area that make their living servicing climbers.
Look, Timmy. It's obvious you don't get out much. Fill up that rattle trap you're driving and go out to the Edison Butte OHV Area to see just how many outdoorsy folks there are. Better yet, drive out to the Santiam Pass OHV area. I guarantee you will be AMAZED at how many folks do the camping thing! Better yet, take the kids with you. They'll be BEGGING you to can the Cedar Point vacation in favor of this!
"Active Outdoor Recreation Generates Economic Growth
Boulder, CO, April 17th, 2007 — The Outdoor Industry Association (OIA) today announced the availability of a report by Outdoor Industry Foundation that details the enormous impact of outdoor recreation on the economies of twenty-one states."
Sounds like it's the Best Time in 20 Years to Take an Outdoor Vacation!!!
Yeah, I already knew the 50 zealots out there would tell me what to do with my kids when I was talking about what Americans do with their vacations. I've been to Smith Rock, and it's not as crowded as some amusement parks.
Not everybody likes to spend every waking moment biking, hiking, skiing, snowboarding and rock climbing. (In fact I would think a life spent that way would be incredibly boring for any intelligent human being above the age of 10 or 11.)
So... People who prefer other indoorsy pursuits have an aura of smug intellectual superiority??
Timothy said...
I've been to Smith Rock, and it's not as crowded as some amusement parks.
And your point is... ?
>>And your point is... ?
Sigh. "Outdoors" is not an economy. It won't save us. It won't save our housing prices. There has to be more, we can't just rely on visitors! Especially with gas prices going up.
Ohhh... I thought Timmy's point was this:
Bend is where you go skiing, it's not where you take the kids. You take the kids somewhere where there's something to do...The percentage of Americans willing to drive a long time to do something outside is pretty small.
And now he's saying: "Outdoors is not an economy"
??!!
Of course outdoor recreation will not "save us" if its the ONLY component of our town's economy. But that's not the case. And you are way off base if you think outdoor recreation does not have a significant impact on our economy.
Timothy said...
Sure, you'll get the usual crowd of athletic, health-conscious people. I don't see that as a growth opportunity.
Well, those Outdoor Growth Activities numbers posted above sure blows THAT argument out of the water.
Dude, I get it now. I thought Timmy was trying to say that Americans are fat.
>> Sounds like it's the Best Time in 20 Years to Take an Outdoor Vacation!!!
Going out on a limb here but I'm declaring this best comment of the day!
Timmy, I couldn't agree more. Outdoorsy activities generate little revenue other than the initial purchases at REI.
The activity itself is an exercise in thriftiness. How much can we "do without" and still survive and be relatively comfortable?
No hotels, no restaurants, and (worst of all!) NO CONTACT WITH REAL ESTATE SALES PERSONS.
Now there's a new angle for you guys to try, start hitting the trails with flyers.
June 16, 2003
Garrison Keillor, host of public radio's "A Prairie Home Companion," took his show on the road to Bend this weekend, and got in some gentle pokes at Oregon's fastest-growing city.
Keillor described the Bend residents arrayed before him at the Les Schwab Amphitheater as "handsome, skinny people" and said the city "was once a lumbering town -- by that I mean the timber industry, not the way the people walked."
In a skit featuring Guy Noir, an old-fashioned private eye who is one of the program's signature characters, Keillor told the story of a Minnesota farmer who fled to Bend "to play golf."
The farmer wasn't hard for Noir to find, however -- he was wearing "barn boots" on the course, Keillor said.
Keillor also poked fun at a Bend ordinance that requires dog owners to pick up their pet's excrement, saying the rule seemed to fly in the face of everything the Old West represented.
"John Wayne did not go after his pooch with a baggie in hand!" Keillor exclaimed.
Quimby said...
Outdoorsy activities generate little revenue...No hotels, no restaurants,
Ok, then explain why the hotels all have No Vacancy signs posted during hunting sesaon in Burns, Baker City, John Day etc.
Then surely you are aware of the popularity of Smith Rock as an international rock climbing destination.
Don't know this first-hand but I've been hearing that advanced climbers consider Smith Rock passe.
Yeah, and I guess the thousands of morally superior and thrify outdoorsy folks who swamp Bend during the Pole Pedal Paddle all stay in pup tents and eat beanie-weinies.
So... People who prefer other indoorsy pursuits have an aura of smug intellectual superiority??
Not intellectual -- physical. They're always rubbing it in your face how fit and healthy they are and how pure their lifestyle is. And they seem to think they're all going to live to be 200.
Personally I believe longevity is 95% heredity and 5% luck, and the rest is lifestyle.
>>Ok, then explain why the hotels all have No Vacancy signs posted during hunting sesaon in Burns, Baker City, John Day etc.
Oh, I'm sure the owner of the Bates in Vale is making millions during chukar season.
I bet he barely survives....
You're saying that Hunting season now supports our ever expanding wonderful blissful central Oregon econ?
And loads and loads of Cali's are driving their families up for a wonderful vacation: Elk hunting in the cold wet snowy Ochocos. Gee Dad, can we goto the Dairy Queen in John Day?????
Come on ... this has gone on long enough. They are going to Disneyland vs. BFE!!!!!
Me personally, BFE, but the vast population of slugs will pick Hawaii/Disneyland etc.
Yep, and those intellectually inferior Pole Pedal Paddle outdoorsy folks wouldn't even THINK to patronize the local sports shops to rent skis and kayaks and bikes.
It's absurd to compare the tourism attraction of Bend with Disneyland.
The fact remains that outdoor recreation and tourism are major components of Bend's economy.
And what started this whole brouhaha is that the local restaurants are banking on this. And rightfully so.
>>You're saying that Hunting season now supports our ever expanding wonderful blissful central Oregon econ?
Yes, hunters support our Central Oregon economy. Been to Sportsman's Warehouse lately?
Pole Pedal Paddle
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
OUR SAVIOUR!!! WE'LL BE RICH! We need 50 more of these events to sucker tourists here to buy overpriced real estate.
BULLSHIT. GO BACK TO CALI.
The real estate economy of the past is what has brought Bend to its knees now. We don't WANT "sucker tourists" to buy anymore real estate.
We want them to pour tourist dollars into our economy. We want them to eat at our restaurants. We want them to shop at our stores. We want them to fill up their ATVs and boats with gas and buy food at the corner stores. We want them to ski at Mt. B and we want them to book rafting trips. We want them to hire outfitters and guides. We want them to fill up our hotels and resorts. We are open for business! And the more successful we are at catering to the tourists and outdoorsy folks, the more empty houses our business owners and employees will buy up.
"Well, those Outdoor Growth Activities numbers posted above sure blows THAT argument out of the water."
Well, if you are going to take the word of a cheerleading squad then you'd better run out and buy a few Bend houses right now before "The Best Time" passes!
>> Been to Sportsman's Warehouse lately?
Sportsmans = Walmart
GREAT for the local econ with the low wage clerk jobs.
Yes though, hunting DOES have some impact on our local economy....just not enough to bank on, I fear.
Chew on these annual tourism statistics for awhile...
Times Square - 35 million visitors
Las Vegas Strip - 31 million
Disneyland - 14.9 mil
Great Smoky Mtns Natl Park - 9.4 mil
Lake Mead Natl Rec Area - 7.6 mil
Central Oregon - 2.5 mil
>> Central Oregon - 2.5 mil
I can see the wheels turning:
Hmmm, is it enough to support my hair-brained business scheme and my family's move from Cali?
Answer: No, it is not. Please stay where you are.
And these employment statistics ...
Deschutes County 2007 Covered Employment and Wages
NAICS 713 - Amusements, gambling, and recreation
Employment: 1,902
Payroll: $33,686,939
This doesn't include sporting goods stores, operators of resorts and hunting and fishing camps, or operators of sightseeing buses and scenic flights and helicopter rides.
-- bendbb
From Census.gov:
713 Amusement, Gambling, and Recreation Industries
Industries in the Amusement, Gambling, and Recreation Industries subsector (1) operate facilities where patrons can primarily engage in sports, recreation, amusement, or gambling activities and/or (2) provide other amusement and recreation services, such as supplying and servicing amusement devices in places of business operated by others; operating sports teams, clubs, or leagues engaged in playing games for recreational purposes; and guiding tours without using transportation equipment.
This subsector does not cover all establishments providing recreational services. Other sectors of NAICS also provide recreational services. Providers of recreational services are often engaged in processes classified in other sectors of NAICS. For example, operators of resorts and hunting and fishing camps provide both accommodation and recreational facilities and services. These establishments are classified in Subsector 721, Accommodation, partly to reflect the significant costs associated with the provision of accommodation services and partly to ensure consistency with international standards. Likewise, establishments using transportation equipment to provide recreational and entertainment services, such as those operating sightseeing buses, dinner cruises, or helicopter rides, are classified in Subsector 48-49, Transportation and Warehousing.
The industry groups in this subsector highlight particular types of activities: amusement parks and arcades, gambling industries, and other amusement and recreation industries. The groups, however, are not all inclusive of the activity. The Gambling Industries industry group does not provide for full coverage of gambling activities. For example, casino hotels are classified in Subsector 721, Accommodation; and horse and dog racing tracks are classified in Industry Group 7112, Spectator Sports.
So, just guessing but Bachelor and Hoodoo are maybe half of that $33 million number? I'm thinking that Nosler does not fit into this category.
Ok, then explain why the hotels all have No Vacancy signs posted during hunting sesaon in Burns, Baker City, John Day etc.
How long is the hunting season? How many hotel rooms are we talking about?
Hunting was one of the big drivers of CO tourism back in ye olde days but it's only a small fraction of what it used to be, and the number of people nationally who hunt has been dropping like a rock. Fishing is holding up a little better, but not much. I would not bank on those sports to sustain our economy, or any other.
Deschutes County 2007 Covered Employment and Wages
NAICS 713 - Amusements, gambling, and recreation
Employment: 1,902
Less than 2,000 people in a population of nearly 150,000. I am not impressed.
>> Less than 2,000 people in a population of nearly 150,000. I am not impressed.
With an average annual wage of $17,711.32 to boot. WOW!
Me personally, BFE, but the vast population of slugs will pick Hawaii/Disneyland etc.
Any outdoor activity you can do in Central Oregon (except snow sports, of course) you can do in Hawaii, plus swimming, snorkeling, scuba diving and deep-sea fishing, AND you have beautiful weather for it almost year-round. Expense aside, why the hell would any rational person (slug or non-slug) rather go here? CO is okay as a cheap vacation or weekend destination for people from Portland and the Valley, but it's absurd to think it will ever be a tourist draw comparable to Hawaii.
Oh yeah, don't forget surfing and windsurfing.
So, just guessing but Bachelor and Hoodoo are maybe half of that $33 million number?
Hoodoo is in Linn County.
Less than 2,000 people in a population of nearly 150,000. I am not impressed.
The people working in outdoor recreation probably don't care whether you're impressed or not, but they do care about their jobs. Our economy is diverse and outdoor recreation is one part of that. An owner of a longtime local guide service told me recently that his business is at an all-time high this year.
-- bendbb
COVA Economic Impact Study:
In 2006, employment directly generated by travel spending in Central Oregon was 7040 jobs, nearly 10% of the total workforce. The travel-spending payroll generated $149.3 million.
Bend bb hath spoken.
Amen and amen.
Quimby: I can see the wheels turning: "Hmmm, is it enough to support my hair-brained business scheme and my family's move from Cali?"
Maybe, just maybe. The CO economy is becoming more competitive for ventures such as light manufacturing. ABC news said that the average cost of shipping a container on a container ship from China to California used to be $3,000. It is now $8,000. Consequently, manufacturing in China for the American market is not as financially advantageous as it once was, and there might be an upswing in manufacturing in this area
Consequently, manufacturing in China for the American market is not as financially advantageous as it once was, and there might be an upswing in manufacturing in this area
That would be welcome news indeed. But the cost of shipping manufactured products by truck or rail from CO also is going to rise a lot, I would imagine.
Our economy is diverse and outdoor recreation is one part of that.
-- bendbb
Woof... what the hell you smokin', BendBB?
Our economy is INCREDIBLY CONCENTRATED. I've never lived in a place (with this population), and only visited a few places MORE dependent on such a SMALL number of industries.
Tell me how many industries we have with over 1,000 people making greater than the AVG per capita salary? Medical? RE used to be, but they're busted. Construction, same.
NOTHING pays a decent wage, IN LARGE NUMBERS, except maybe medical. MFG is fleeing.
What we do have is 100's & 100's of extremely LOW WAGE, barely surviving facility-based businesses, like restaurants, oil change places, cracker-ass Me-Too retail (how many freakin art galleries do we need?) & meth-dealer motels. These places pay the owner $28K, and 20 illegals $1.75 hr + tips.
Dude... I mean, keep the stiff upper lip... but our economy IS NOT diverse.
And "outdoor" bullshit economy is the stronghold of the poor. I routinely engage in "outdoor" activity BECAUSE I want to spend as little as possible. The vast majority of my "recreational" dollar go to gas money to get to places.
Recreation has been Californicated to an extent that it barely resembles an "outdoor activity". Cali's love to CONSUMERIZE something that is a DIRECT ATTEMPT TO ESCAPE CONSUMERISM, because they are by & large 100% RETARDED.
And to that LEZBOT: Listen honey, you & your girlie friend munching carpet is fine with me, and in fact most men dig watching you chicks get strange on each other. What we hate, as does the entire World, is watching fags butt-hump each other. Unless you ugly. Then we don't like watching you either.
Just remember: Be Hot.
(He's ba-aaack!)
"Heeere's Johnny!"
>>I routinely engage in "outdoor" activity BECAUSE I want to spend as little as possible.
So, are you ridin' around town on a rusty Huffy 3-speed?
Skiing on Olin Mark II 205's?
Still making do with that Popeil Pocket Fisherman?
Cascade Festival of Music needs to go on the bubble victims R.I.P. list.
Tourism is surely important but it's not something that we should purposely be anchoring our local economy on. It's a fallback. What did people on the Oregon Coast do when timber and fishing disappeared? Fell back on tourism.
And our tourism, as has been pointed out, is based not on the attractiveness of something manmade, but something God put there. As opposed to Disneyland, New York or Las Vegas. In Las Vegas you almost can't help but spend a lot of money - it's a manmade attraction designed to take your money. In Bend if you want to go camping or fishing you can avoid a lot of expenses (if you're taking a camping vacation, almost by definition you're trying to take a cheap vacation). You can use the same tent and campstove for 20 years. You can sleep outdoors instead of in a motel. You can bring your food in from a supermarket outside the area.
What about golf vacations? As has been pointed out many, many times, almost every golf course in this area is a "loss-leader" amenity that's designed to rope in homebuyers and was never designed to make money. The popularity and profitability of golf is just not there in an area where the cold season lasts 7 months. They would have to pack golfers in every day of the season to make money, and you can see at almost all the courses around here that this is just not happening.
Anyway, tourism isn't going to come close to replacing real estate as an economic driver around here. The economic impact from the kind of tourist attractions we have is so much lower than the impact of development and homebuilding.
Anyway, tourism isn't going to come close to replacing real estate as an economic driver around here.
Good. We don't want anymore greed-based economic drivers like real estate.
Top 50 Private Employers in Central Oregon (2008)
St Charles Medical Center – 3088
Les Schwab Tire Centers – 1500
Bright Wood Corp – 1057
Sunriver Resort – 950
Mt Bachelor – 886
T-Mobile – 824
Safeway – 666
Walmart – 623
TRG (iSky) – 564
Bend Memorial Clinic – 510
Parr Lumber – 500
Fred Meyer – 470
Jeld-Wen Windows & Doors – 302
Kah-nee-tah Resort – 420
Cessna – 418
Jeld-Wen Development – 302
Hooker Creek – 300
Athletic Club of Bend – 300
Costco – 292
Ray’s Grocery – 292
The Riverhouse - 284
Opportunity Foundation - 280
Bank of the Cascades - 279
Knife River Corp. - 275
Albertson’s Supermarkets - 264
The Bulletin - 264
Lowe’s - 260
Black Butte Ranch - 236
PCC Schlosser (aerospace mfg) – 229
Brooks Resources - 225
Home Depot - 210
BendBroadband – 210
Keith Manufacturing - 210
JELD-WEN Millworks Manufacturing - 203
Central Oregon Trucking - 200
Kirby Nagelhout - 200
LifeWise Health Plans - 199
Western Title - 195
Deschutes Brewery - 176
Edge Wireless - 175
Bend Research - 169
Macy’s - 166
The Center (Medical Care & Research) - 160
Epic Aircraft - 155
Target Stores - 147
Clear Choice Health Plans - 147
Microsemi Power Products Group - 147
Wells Fargo Bank - 140
Seventh Mountain Resort - 140
NeighborImpact - 138
Total Private Employment 63,550
Total Government Employment 8,240
NOTHING pays a decent wage, IN LARGE NUMBERS, except maybe medical.
News Flash: The high paying jobs in Oregon are concentrated in the Portland Metro area. If you moved to Bend for the wages you made a mistake. Corporate Jobs "R" Not Us.
When I lived in Portland I knew quite a few people who hated their jobs, but in Bend not so many. Of course it's easy to hate being a corporate desk jockey, and it's even easier to enjoy being a climbing guide.
-- bendbb
Primary Industries in Deschutes County
Health Services
Headquarter Services (Les Schwab)
Wood Products Manufacturing
Leisure & Hospitality
Education
Computer & Electronic Manufacturing - (Central Oregon is fastest growing high technology area in Oregon.)
Aircraft/Aerospace Manufacturing
Medical Technology Manufacturing & Development
Medical Research
Light Industrial & Manufacturing
Recreational Equipment Manufacturing
Transportation, Warehousing & Utilities
Professional & Business Services
Top 50 Private Employers in Central Oregon (2008)
And just look at those, and see how many pay a wage that'll buy a DECENT house here. That means $475K.
St Charles? Some.
T-Mobile, Safeway, WAL-MART? uh, no.
All we got is RE & Tourism, and RE used to pay quite a few people a decent wage, that included construction. Now it's 100% busted, and Tourism will never pay worth a shit.
REMEMBER: Someone making 120% of the MED FAMILY wage here would NOT AFFORD 92% of the homes. Just like Cali. This equal 100% DOOM. We're dead. Cali also DEAD. The above stat is EVEN WORSE for high cost centers like LA & San Fran. AT least they have something besides a fucking WAL-MART to bring them back. We have fucking Wal-Mart & My Bachelor (100% VOLUNTEER BULLSHIT JOBS).
When I lived in Portland I knew quite a few people who hated their jobs, but in Bend not so many. Of course it's easy to hate being a corporate desk jockey, and it's even easier to enjoy being a climbing guide.
That's true, plus I don't think a lot of people really feel that what they do is who they are in Bend. Your "Bend job," if you're a rat race escapee, as opposed to your former "career job" is just a way to pay the bills for a while so you don't get frustrated by it as much as you would if you knew this is your life's work.
For a lot of people, moving to Bend is an extension of adolescence into adulthood: to play more than you work, for nothing you do to really "count" (what happens in Bend stays in Bend) and, in the tradition of the pioneers, to feel like you're accomplishing something just by living in a place that's the new place to be.
to feel like you're accomplishing something just by living in a place that's the new place to be...
An extremely expensive hobby. Ask any Cali transplant that's opened The Store They Always Wanted here: That convenience store in NWX, Apricot Lane, Painted Pony... some old, some new, but retail & restaurant in Bend is entering a LONG GRINDING DEPRESSION.
I almost feel bad for some of these Cali-bangers who done thrown down their life savings for the chance to Live The Dream in little 'ol Bend Oregon. Most cannot re-up their 3 year lease.
Bye bye 401K.
CACB: $7.79/sh.
MossCo should RIGHT SIZE that resume soon.
CACB: $7.60/sh.
Book Val: $279MM
Market Val: $213MM
Yield: 5.26%
P/E: 8.17
Q1 2008 ROE: 8.74%
ROA: 1.01%
CACB is falling so fast here I've had to update the price twice just while typing this.
CACB starts to get interesting here as a takeover play. There's better value in the banking area, but CACB is making up ground in the mega-plummet...
If (Big IF) CACB can sustain $5MM per quarter in net income for the long haul, and it seems reasonable given L/T rates to impute a 10 P/E on it, then that's a fair value of around $200MM, which it is close to hitting.
Of course I HATE buying stuff at "fair" value... I like it at half that. But at $7.50 it's approaching reasonable. I think it'd have a hell of a pop if MossCo got fired & they cleaned house.
Per capita Income---Median Family Income---Family Purchasing Power
Lake Oswego, OR -----$42,166-----$109,549-----$101,622
Wilsonville, OR----------$29,786-------$76,904------$71,340
Beaverton, OR----------$25,419-------$69,793------$64,743
Portland, OR------------$22,643-------$57,826------$53,642
Bend, OR-----------------$21,624-------$56,845------$51,447
Salem, OR----------------$19,141-------$54,901------$50,929
Anaheim, CA-------------$18,266-------$59,230------$45,589
Honolulu, HI-------------$24,191-------$66,344------$41,131
Detroit, MI---------------$14,717-------$39,077------$40,161
Got your knife ready to hack up those statistics, Johnny?
Can I call you Jack?
We don't want anymore greed-based economic drivers like real estate.
Can you name any economic driver that is NOT "greed-based"? People start businesses to make money, not (as a rule) as philanthropic exercises.
For a lot of people, moving to Bend is an extension of adolescence into adulthood ...
Damn, you said it. Permanent adolescence is the normal condition here.
I almost feel bad for some of these Cali-bangers ...
You and other Bend olde-tymers are always reviling the "Calis," but in fact most of the equity emigres who move here come from Portland, the Valley and the Seattle area.
Adding to this Bizarro World market:
Ford is worth twice as much as GM.
GM has a book value of about -$41 billion. Yup, that's MINUS. Ford at least is in the black there, with a net worth of $7.1BB.
Both are probably near technical bankruptcy, but are still interesting nonetheless, as they are the Bear Stearns of US MFG, and would probably get bailed out by ``someone".
My Bottom Feeder Antennae have perked up in the past several days...
Ford, CACB, Wash Mu, already bought MNC & PFE. I'm like Taleb at heart: A large number of extremely speculative issues in small amounts... and a big slug of cash.
Can you name any economic driver that is NOT "greed-based"? People start businesses to make money..
Well, according to IHTBYB, those businesses are just extremely expensive hobbies.
But then he's not an entrepreneur, and wouldn't know.
I would say most people start businesses that are an expression of who they are. They want to fill a need in the community.
"I would say most people start businesses that are an expression of who they are. They want to fill a need in the community."
Sounds like a good way to go broke fast.
When my wife and I moved here more than 20 years ago we said to ourselves: "Hey, this community NEEDS another good wine shop." What we really meant was: "WE WANT another good wine shop." The reason there weren't more good wine shops was that "the community" at that time didn't really need or want them. Fortunately we realized that before we went and sunk a lot of money into a wine shop.
Moral: Your "gut feeling" about what "the community needs" is no substitute for solid, hard-nosed market research. If the community doesn't have a particular kind of business, chances are it's because there really isn't a demand for it.
Of course there are the pioneers like Gary Fish, who opened the first brewpub in Bend 20 years ago and ended up making a fortune (although there were a lot of people at the time who predicted he would lose his shirt). But you have to be either very astute or very lucky in your timing to pull that off.
But then he's not an entrepreneur, and wouldn't know.
Thanks for that obviously well-informed opinion.
>>Of course there are the pioneers like Gary Fish...
...who has become an icon in our community and a tremendous philanthropist.
Are you saying Gary Fish's incentive was greed and he only started his business because wanted to make money ??!
I know for a fact that is not the case.
>>If the community doesn't have a particular kind of business, chances are it's because there really isn't a demand for it.
It's a good thing most entrepreneurial types do NOT think this way. Otherwise, we'd STILL be driving into the valley for all of our needs.
The best businesses for the local economy are something that not only fulfills a local need, but a broader need. Then it will employ local people and export product, whether regionally, nationally, or globally. Deschutes Brewery is a good example. Software houses, specialty manufacturing, creative shops (advertising, etc.), medical center for the region, etc., especially stuff where shipping is not a huge cost.
Stongly supported education is part of this, although I'm not real sure about building a new locally funded institution is better than building on the ones up on the hill that already exist.
One of our biggest problems is that RE is/was such a huge part of the local economy. There is virtually no barrier to entry, it doesn't require much education, and it is self defeating in the long run because the growth it is predicated on will ruin the quality of life. To say nothing of the boom/bust nature of the business.
Are you saying Gary Fish's incentive was greed and he only started his business because wanted to make money ??!
No, he wanted to brew and sell quality beer but he ALSO wanted to make money. And if he hadn't made money he'd be out of business now. But he did make money -- lots of it. More power to him.
Making money is NOT a sin or a crime, contrary to what many in the purer-than-thou PC crowd seem to think.
It's a good thing most entrepreneurial types do NOT think this way. Otherwise, we'd STILL be driving into the valley for all of our needs.
Like I said, there are pioneers. Some, like Gary Fish, succeed and reap the rewards. Most come back with arrows in their asses. And I would bet Gary wasn't operating just on a hunch and had some pretty good basis for thinking the Bend market was ready for a brewpub.
He's also been very smart in adopting a market-driven strategy for expanding his business.
RE:Making money is NOT a sin or a crime, contrary to what many in the purer-than-thou PC crowd seem to think.
It's a necessity if you want to stay in business.
I think what the purity crowd may be referring to is making excessive amounts in a short time. Like buying a house in June and flipping it in August for a $50K profit. That worked, for a little while, but it put us in a world of hurt in the long run.
"Then it will employ local people and export product, whether regionally, nationally, or globally. Deschutes Brewery is a good example."
Yes, but Gary Fish didn't set out at first to become a major craft brewer -- he just wanted to have a successful brewpub. The expansion of Deschutes Brewery has been demand-driven all along, as Gary will tell you.
I think what the purity crowd may be referring to is making excessive amounts in a short time.
Yeah, but how much is "excessive" and how short a time is "too short"? I'd rather not embark down that slippery slope.
The subprime mortgage crisis was not really caused by flippers, but by unscrupulous lenders making loans that the borrowers had no way in hell to repay -- aided in many cases by unscrupulous appraisers who were willing to ridiculously overstate the value of properties.
Re:The expansion of Deschutes Brewery has been demand-driven all along, as Gary will tell you.
Exactly, and it was/became a product that had a potential demand beyond Bend city limits. Plus it is a premium product that commands a premium price, which made it profitable, which gave it the ability to expand as the market grew. It's a good model to follow, whether it's beer, solar power invertors or whatever.
Notice to Fractional Owners of Dept of Justice Filing
June 4th, 2008
INN of the Seventh Mountain-Fractional Share -Condo Buyers Department of Justice Investigation Opened
The Oregon Department of Justice opened an investigation in February, 2008, for people who have complained about their transaction regarding the purchase of real estate at the Inn of the Seventh Mountain, Bend, Oregon, from INNspired, LLC and Pape Properties Inc. of Eugene, Oregon, and the subsequent assessment of $17.7 million dollars levied upon condo purchasers.
The real estate sales advertisement for the Inn was launched as early as 2003, and public advertisings did announce a $20 million dollar renovation to the Inn and launching fractional share opportunities. Buyers concerns are for being assessed for the developers/sellers past and future renovations as stated in their advertisements.
This posting is to direct anyone with complaints directly to the Oregon Department of Justice with their concern or complaint against INNspired, LLC and/or Pape Properties Inc. Contact DOJ if you wish to be included in any settlement that they negotiate with INNspired, LLC and/or Pape Properties Inc.
Snail mail to:
Jan Margosian
Department of Justice
Financial Fraud-Consumer Protection
1162 Court Street
Salem OR 97310
FedEx or UPS mailings:
Jan Margosian
Department of Justice
Financial Fraud-Consumer Protection
340 Vista SE
Salem OR 97302
Phone: Jan Margosian 503-934-4400
Fax: 503-378-5017
This is going to get real interesting...
Just found out SF is going down, down, down!
Check this out...New Case/Schiller data. 40% off sale coming soon.
http://tinyurl.com/6pekm5
If I of knew another way to do this I would..any suggestions?
Marge,
I wonder how many of the people dealing in 2010 SF futures are hedging their own houses.
If I of knew another way to do this I would..any suggestions?
margie, they don't understand.
They are lovers of The Fudge. They love to create it, chill it, mix it with nuts, roll it out and most of all, pack it.
Don't be apologetic, dear.
It's the fudge.
ihatetoburstyourbubble said...
Recreation has been Californicated to an extent that it barely resembles an "outdoor activity".
IHTBYB, give some examples to back up your opinion:
Below is the list of outdoor activities that someone posted earlier. Please place a check next to the ones that have been "Californicated to an extent that it barely resembles an outdoor activity."
Riding the lifts and hike at Mt. Bachelor
Rafting/tubing/kayaking down Deschutes River
Canoeing on one of the Cascade Lakes
Camping
Spelunking at Lava River Cave
Geology tour of Lava Butte, Fort Rock, Crack in the Ground
Parks: Shevlin, Harmon, Drake, Tumalo, Cline Falls
Swimming at Juniper or Sunriver
Horseback riding at Sunriver or Seventh Mountain
Scenic flights above Cascades, Crater Lake
Rock hunting at Richardson's Rock Ranch and Glass Butte
Rock climbing at Smith Rock
Mountain climbing on South Sister
Mountain biking at Phil's trail system
Road bike riding
Boating, fishing, hiking at Newberry Crater
Hiking river trail along Deschutes
Fishing on river
Golfing
Summer Sunday concert at Les Schwab amphitheater
Farmers market (Wednesday PM)
Munch and Music (Thursday PM)
Munch and Movie (Friday PM)
High Desert Museum
Pine Mountain observatory
Fly fishing on the Crooked River
Sailing on Elk Lake
Hiking Pilot Butte
Other
Please place a check next to the ones that have been "Californicated to an extent that it barely resembles an outdoor activity."
You're from Cali, right?
EVERY SINGLE ONE.
$1,000 MT BACHELOR SEASON PASSES, $500 WADDERS, $3,000 FISHING GUIDES, GOLFING (FUCK ME), CAMPING (FUCK ME AGAIN)...
My God, you just proved my point better than I EVER COULD HAVE.
Farmers market (Wednesday PM)
Munch and Music (Thursday PM)
Munch and Movie (Friday PM)
Huh?
These are PERIPHERALLY & COINCIDENTALLY outdoors. My God.
Go back to Disney World. That's outside.
You're from Cali, right?
No, born and raised in the Midwest. Bend resident for 20 years.
You have failed miserably to prove your point.
I do so because Mr. Doh, in one of his blogger rages, told me to "get the fuck out" because I disagreed with his logic on one point.
You gotta grow a thicker skin then, dear.
And it probably WAS NOT BECAUSE I disagreed with you. It was because you needed it.
I am here to educate. And when necessary, horrify. And offend. And tell the ignorant to Get The Fuck Out.
You have failed miserably to prove your point.
No. You've simply exposed yourself as a Cali-Sympathizer.
They are fucking locusts. They must be exterminated. That's all I know.
I am here to educate.
You have still failed to prove your point that all of those activities have been Californicated to an extent that they barely resemble outdoor activities.
I didn't learn anything from your comment.
You've simply exposed yourself as a Cali-Sympathizer.
No, I simply have participated in nearly every one of those activities. And I have never noticed that they have been Californicated.
Have you participated in all of those activities? I don't mean to offend you, but maybe you are the ignorant one on this point.
Fudge packers?
Sounds like a Baby Ruth Bar.
Couple of weeks ago, I removed my office mates chair and replaced it with nasty looking toilet and set 2Baby Ruth bars (from the movie Caddy Shack) in the bottom of it. Man ya got to have some fun now and then. Things are slowely going to crap but life needs to have some levity, don't ya think. Lighten up. SF is going down just as you have predicted.
Bend sales have slowed as never before in June, it may be the first time in 30 years(my term) that June did not beat May sales. We will know in a week or so. But last month 106 sold and this month as of today 81???? May not hit the bar.
Cash is King...Gold a close second.
So Sunday I really expect some real genius rant..it is all excelerating at a snails pace,as it should. After all we are climbing into the 2012 spaceship Odessey and when we land we had better have some tangible goods worth something to others.
I think I would like to climb into a spaceship about now.
Happy weekend all!
Awaiting the Sunday AM Rant as always.
Donkeys!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>>>Please place a check next to the ones that have been "Californicated to an extent that it barely resembles an outdoor activity."
***
I think half of them were destroyed by Californication and half by Oregonorrhea.
SPECIAL ALERT: as warned for many months a major global “upheaval” is in progress -- spurred by the one-two punch of run-away inflation & a collapse of the derivatives/credit markets -- which will affect everyone. Many banks are at risk. Investors who continue to procrastinate or wait optimistically for storm clouds to dissipate, will in the main, see their assets deflate radically & at best risk losing much or most of their net buying power &/or capital. If not already done so, we urge that U immediately reduce financial risk via 3 basic steps: exit the US$ (or hedge exposure to US$ assets of any kind via futures short selling &/or bank forward contacts), place approx ½ of your assets into a mix of 90-day to 2-year govt bills/bonds (Swiss govt paper preferred, but any (non-US$) 1st world govt paper OK), place almost ½ of your assets in gold (via a basket of gold futures &/or quality gold shares, with at least 15% in physical gold bars or coins). A small position in oil/food/comod stocks & special situations is justified. See HSL for details on July 6.
IHateToBurstYourBubble said...
They are lovers of The Fudge. They love to create it, chill it, mix it with nuts, roll it out and most of all, pack it.
You are totally off your nut tonight. What are you smokin, drinken, snorting, crap don't inhale. ><<<'>
you have ben warned we are entering uncharted waters.prepare it will happen sooner than you think.My grandad who survived the great depression said the resourcefull will survive.
reality sucks think about it for a minute civil war 1863 they really sufered. oh wait a minute history repeats itself The end of the roman empire. Sorry figure it out for yourselves.
Re: Sorry figure it out for yourselves.
Wouldn't a 9 mil work better for self defense than a bar of gold?
What are you smokin, drinken, snorting, crap don't inhale. ><<<'>
It was drinken.
Yesterday's Bulletin article said the music festival just wasn't getting enough donations, due to the economy.
I wish some of those top-performing rafting outfitters and hiking guides could have stepped up to the plate after the Realtors died off.
I wish some of those top-performing rafting outfitters and hiking guides could have stepped up to the plate...
Yeah, I've had it with these chintzy MULTI-MILLIONAIRE fishing guides hoarding their money like SCROOGE.
Tourism: Central Oregon's Economic Panacea.
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